"Shock and Awe"

[Daishiman]

Not for the faint of heart.

You've been warned...

http://www.marchforjustice.com/id191.htm

[shade]

Lol what a load of bullshit. Thanks, i havent seen so much on one site yet.

Time for a line by line of the site!

Zionist Harlan Ullman is taking a horrific toll on the Iraqi children of Baghdad and elsewhere in Iraq. Ullman is a Jewish “defense intellectual.” He was the Navy's “head of extended planning” and taught at the National War College. One of his students was Secretary of State Colin Powell, who says he “raised my vision several levels.”
Ok, Collin Powell had a jew teacher. Wow, I bet you have too. We better not let Jews teach. Even better, lets just put them all in death camps! I bet that one of his most important lessons was called "killing civilians that dont like jews."

The American people are not being shown the horrific devastation that the massive tons of bombs and missiles are causing to Iraqi civilians including its children. La Voz de Aztlan has collected the following pictures from the non-Jewish dominated media to show the Mexican-American community and the USA community in general the horrible slaughter the U.S. military is inflicting on the children of Iraq.
We are being shown it. We have internet access. We just tend to check reputable sources like Al Jazeera. The fact is, this war has had fewer civilian casulties than any in history, and that frankly pisses the hell out of protestors because civilian casulties is one of their main arguments against war. So, sites like this show what few pictures there are and allude that there are much much more. Well, show them, all of them. Oh wait, they are.

We remain committed to preserving the rich culture
Under this quote they show footage of the destroyed mobile TV broadcasting truck that the Iraqi government uses to release pre recorded tapes of Saddam to create an illusion that he is still in full control of the country, which scares the people in to not trying to revolt against the government yet. Then there are two pictures that dont show casulties, just distressed people. Which frankly, is going to happen. Even if I knew I wasnt a target and buildings near me were being bombed all night I would have a hard time sleeping and would probably be scared just like them.

I am satisfied that we have done all that we can do, again...
Under this quote there is a picture of a girl and presumably her mother, and smoke behind them. Their faces have no expression. Frankly, they are probably tired and have been walking a while. If there were US troops fighting against the Iraqi army in my home town, I wouldnt want to stay in the town during the fighting either. War isnt pretty, but I gurantee you no soldiers were assholes to them.
Then you see a pic of a lady with her arms spread. That could mean anything as well. Heck, she could be lamenting over the abuse she sustained under the regime.

Soon the Iraqi people will see the great compassion of
Ok, havent you heard about the Fedahiim dressing up in uniforms to resemble allied troops then accepting the surrender of Iraqi troops? We are not executing prisoners. If you believe we are, you need to go live in a different country.
Then of course theres the fuck iraq picture, while funny, probably just photoshop.

This will be a campaign unlike any other in history
Yes, and these too pictures prove it. If there were more people in that hospital injured from our bombs, why not zoom out a little? Its unfortunate that these people were hurt... but they are probably the extent of the injuries of innocents in that hospital from our bombs.

You see people who are tasting, for the first time...
That bomb has been proven to be an Iraq surface to air missiile that missed and fell back to earth... in a market place.
Ok, they took down a helecopter.

In the big scope of things, we're on track. We're on..
That kid looks like hes sick. Obviously, anyone in a hospital, must be there because the great white devil put them there. Afterall, no one in Iraq has health problems unless they are being invaded.
Then we see a picture of men in military garb looking at a destroyed building. Ok...? Dont see any corpses or distressed civilians in this picture.
Yay, pictures of civilians waving at us.
Picture of lady taking out the trash, and covering her mouth and nose with a cloth to not smell it.

You got to go in there and bust their chops badly
A picture of a kid who may or may not have been hurt by us.
Then we see the first genuine child casulty on this website. It is very sad indeed. But what about the thousands of children that died quietly from starvation or being orphaned under saddams rule? She died to prevent that in the future. Dont let it be in vain.

I can assure the American people that we're making
Same kid.
New kid.
New kid.
Picture of woman that looks happy.

To the Iraqi people, let me say that the day of your
Picture of a guy that could be a soldier quite frankly.
*Again.
Definately a soldier, note the helmet.
Uninjured kid, I bet an allied soldier gave him the flu.

We know its outcome. We will prevail......the Iraqi
A mangled guy, for all we know a soldier.
A sleeping kid with no visual bandages who may be there for athsma.
*THE SAME PICTURE OF A GUY REPEATED.
Possible civilian casulty.

Coalition forces will take every precaution to protect
A dead soldier.
A dead soldier.

There’s pockets of resistance, but we’re making good
A picture of targeted attacks in baghdad. According to the people in the HUMAN SHIELDS organization that are in Baghdad have told reporters that they have not been able to find or hear about a non government or military building being hit. In other words, 100% accuracy in baghdad so far. This is a picture of that accuracy.
Then we see a guy laying down in a truck, says nothing at all. Note the iraqi troops next to it. These are probably members of the local militia or people who have to fight or their family will be killed.
Dead solder.
Possible dead civilian.
Injured girl, sad.
Mosk, smoke from bombs landing near it, mosk is still standing. Yay for precision.

This is not a war against a people. It is not a war
A row of soldiers attending their islamic service.
People worshipping in a mosk that has not been bombed, courtesy of precision.
A US soldier that can manage to still look nice.
More pictures of precision bombs hitting their targets.

We're slowly but surely taking control of that country
Picture of genuine civilian casulty, which has been repeated on other websites too.


Welp, lets see, the site is meant to focus on how shock and awe is mass murder of Iraqi civilians, yet there are only a handful of legitimate deaths in these pictures, and some injuries, and some of both were repeated throughout. Lots of pictures of people. It would be nice to interview these people after the war is over when they can speak freely.

Most of these pictures dont tell a story, and some only seem to. The rest, tell many stories.

This site has 0 facts. Thank you come again.

[Daishiman]

Originally posted by shade
[B]Lol what a load of bullshit. Thanks, i havent seen so much on one site yet.

Time for a line by line of the site!


Ok, Collin Powell had a jew teacher. Wow, I bet you have too. We better not let Jews teach. Even better, lets just put them all in death camps! I bet that one of his most important lessons was called "killing civilians that dont like jews."


We are being shown it. We have internet access. We just tend to check reputable sources like Al Jazeera. The fact is, this war has had fewer civilian casulties than any in history, and that frankly pisses the hell out of protestors because civilian casulties is one of their main arguments against war. So, sites like this show what few pictures there are and allude that there are much much more. Well, show them, all of them. Oh wait, they are.


So any amount of casualties is acceptable, even if they are "minimal"?

The first thign is, there's no way in hell I'm trusting the two sides to give reliable casualty numbers. In a war where civilians are the ones that are supposed to be liberated, for them to die due to a bomb landing on a market or because some moron thinks it's ok to call an airstrike to kill 2 soldiers (disregarding all the buildings around), it seems an oxymoron.


Under this quote they show footage of the destroyed mobile TV broadcasting truck that the Iraqi government uses to release pre recorded tapes of Saddam to create an illusion that he is still in full control of the country, which scares the people in to not trying to revolt against the government yet.


umm, that's your supposition. Suport it with facts, but don't evn think I'm going to believe that spin that it makes peopel fear a revolt against Hussein.

If anything the peopel will rally around the image of Hussein as the only way they can see that they can fight united against an invader.


Then there are two pictures that dont show casulties, just distressed people. Which frankly, is going to happen. Even if I knew I wasnt a target and buildings near me were being bombed all night I would have a hard time sleeping and would probably be scared just like them.


Under this quote there is a picture of a girl and presumably her mother, and smoke behind them. Their faces have no expression. Frankly, they are probably tired and have been walking a while. If there were US troops fighting against the Iraqi army in my home town, I wouldnt want to stay in the town during the fighting either. War isnt pretty, but I gurantee you no soldiers were assholes to them.

The soldiers weren't but I'm sure their missiles sure were.


Then you see a pic of a lady with her arms spread. That could mean anything as well. Heck, she could be lamenting over the abuse she sustained under the regime.


Man, what the hell makes you think that the Iraqi govt. tortures people for fun or something?

The complaints of all human rights organizations about the Iraqi government are their treatment of dissenters. If you want to put it that way, then maybe that homeless guy in the subway is really looking depressed because the US helped to murder Chileans in 1980.


Ok, havent you heard about the Fedahiim dressing up in uniforms to resemble allied troops then accepting the surrender of Iraqi troops? We are not executing prisoners. If you believe we are, you need to go live in a different country.


The most recent news about guantamo are making me belive otherwise.


Then of course theres the fuck iraq picture, while funny, probably just photoshop.

I've seen it one several grass-roots papers, tho I admit that could mean anything.


Yes, and these too pictures prove it. If there were more people in that hospital injured from our bombs, why not zoom out a little? Its unfortunate that these people were hurt... but they are probably the extent of the injuries of innocents in that hospital from our bombs.


That bomb has been proven to be an Iraq surface to air missiile that missed and fell back to earth... in a market place.
Ok, they took down a helecopter.


Is that the latest spin from the pentagon?


That kid looks like hes sick. Obviously, anyone in a hospital, must be there because the great white devil put them there. Afterall, no one in Iraq has health problems unless they are being invaded.



Or unless medical supplies have been desperately needed because of the sanctions put in palce by (guess who) the US.


Then we see a picture of men in military garb looking at a destroyed building. Ok...? Dont see any corpses or distressed civilians in this picture.
Yay, pictures of civilians waving at us.
Picture of lady taking out the trash, and covering her mouth and nose with a cloth to not smell it.


A picture of a kid who may or may not have been hurt by us.
Then we see the first genuine child casulty on this website. It is very sad indeed. But what about the thousands of children that died quietly from starvation or being orphaned under saddams rule? She died to prevent that in the future. Dont let it be in vain.



I remind you again that the sanctions were put in place by the US. If the Iraqi government didn't have the infrastructure necessary for giving them proper aid because they're being bombed every week, then I see the problem coming from the invaders.


Same kid.
New kid.
New kid.
Picture of woman that looks happy.


Picture of a guy that could be a soldier quite frankly.



For all you know I could be a soldier too.


*Again.
Definately a soldier, note the helmet.
Uninjured kid, I bet an allied soldier gave him the flu.


A mangled guy, for all we know a soldier.
A sleeping kid with no visual bandages who may be there for athsma.
*THE SAME PICTURE OF A GUY REPEATED.
Possible civilian casulty.


A dead soldier.
A dead soldier.


A picture of targeted attacks in baghdad. According to the people in the HUMAN SHIELDS organization that are in Baghdad have told reporters that they have not been able to find or hear about a non government or military building being hit. In other words, 100% accuracy in baghdad so far. This is a picture of that accuracy.


Well, according to the personal accounts of journalists in Iraq, telephone stations, as well as LOADS of misfires (many of which landed in completely different countries) have occured.


Then we see a guy laying down in a truck, says nothing at all. Note the iraqi troops next to it. These are probably members of the local militia or people who have to fight or their family will be killed.


BS. You fight because your country is invaded. I would fight too, no matter what government was above me.

Prove to me that they're being forced to fight.


Dead solder.
Possible dead civilian.
Injured girl, sad.
Mosk, smoke from bombs landing near it, mosk is still standing. Yay for precision.


A row of soldiers attending their islamic service.


Yes, the one with the gun probably praying that he kills as many invaders as Allah lets him.


People worshipping in a mosk that has not been bombed, courtesy of precision.
A US soldier that can manage to still look nice.
More pictures of precision bombs hitting their targets.


Picture of genuine civilian casulty, which has been repeated on other websites too.


Welp, lets see, the site is meant to focus on how shock and awe is mass murder of Iraqi civilians, yet there are only a handful of legitimate deaths in these pictures, and some injuries, and some of both were repeated throughout. Lots of pictures of people. It would be nice to interview these people after the war is over when they can speak freely.


I'll ask you this: if your family had to die in order to have "freedom", would you approve of it?


Most of these pictures dont tell a story, and some only seem to. The rest, tell many stories.

This site has 0 facts. Thank you come again.

If you want to interpret pictures the same way you want to interpret diagrams, so be it.

[Serendipity]

Human life is not worth such distruction.....children should not suffer. We are all brought into this world innocent and it is shit like this that starts the hate....Im not for this war Iam not for Bush, Blair, Osama, Saddam, and anyone else who believes killing innocent people for politics...they are all sick and need to be taken out of power, but thats just my opinoin and as the saying goes opinions are like assholes everybody has one....

I weep for the children

[AcdnluvsUSA]

why dont u post something that could be useful to all of us,
like how (vinyl) is making a difference in our lives everyday.

[Serendipity]

Are speaking to me? I didnt say that to start a fight, because I wont. I was just merely stating my opinion. I have done nothing to insult you so why do feel the need to attack me??

[Serendipity]

Hmm, but Im American? Do you dislike me now??? I m not attacking. I believe in being civil with people. Treat others as you would have them treat you

[Serendipity]

Great, i just realized Im gonna be tagged as a "hippie", wonderful *rollseyes*

[shade]

So any amount of casualties is acceptable, even if they are "minimal"?
As long as the civilians that die in this war are less than that would die as a result of Saddam's policies in the future, yes, any number under that. Although naturally, I would prefer as few as possible. No, I wont give you an exact number.

there's no way in hell I'm trusting the two sides to give reliable casualty numbers.
Me neither. If you check both sources you will get an accurate range for yourself. Check US sources for a low number, check Al Jazeera for a high number. Then you can know it is something in between that.

Suport it with facts, but don't evn think I'm going to believe that spin that it makes peopel fear a revolt against Hussein.
Sure. Saddam sends out his messages through it. So far he has sent out pre-recorded tapes. This implies to the people that he is alive and in control. If they revolt now, and the Allied forces do not win, or the decide to not complete the mission, the towns that had people who revolted will have mass executions. By destroying the ability of Saddam's regime to pretend that it is still in total control, you increase the willingness of the people to revolt without fears of mass executions later. It happened after the Gulf War to Basra, and other smaller town.

The soldiers weren't but I'm sure their missiles sure were.
If you mean by explosions being loud and tending to scare children much like thunder, but a little worse, sure they are assholes. I give you that.

Man, what the hell makes you think that the Iraqi govt. tortures people for fun or something?
Because it does. Saddam has a pool in one of his palaces... a normal looking pool. But it has acid instead of water. And he does enjoy to watch people killed in it. So says a bodyguard of his that defected. His son Udaa (sp?) is a serial rapist. He can point to a woman to have her kidnapped and brought back for him to rape and torture as he pleases. These are people you do not want to defend, lest you look evil yourself. And its not "dissentors". Its any political opposition. YOU (i assume you are a democrat or at least vote democrat) would be kidnapped and tortured to try to change your mind to make sure you vote for Bush in next election or wanted to lead another political party if we were like the Iraqi regime. YOUR family would be beaten and raped, regardless of age if you still didnt change your mind to vote for bush. Your daughter, 4 years old, would have 3 dicks put in her in front of you while your wife was being treated likewise. You can keep defending them all you want.

The most recent news about guantamo are making me belive otherwise.
?? We arent executing prisoners or treating prisoners in ways that violate Geneva. You need to elaborate when you say things like that.

I've seen it one several grass-roots papers, tho I admit that could mean anything.
Hehe, then it may be true. Very funny. Maybe they just didnt have a crew big enough to spell out "Fuck Saddam's Regime."

Is that the latest spin from the pentagon?
No, its that even one of our 500 lb bombs would have done much more damage, not to mention our 1000 and 2000 lb bombs which make up the majority of our bombs. And, we had nothing targeted there. It wasnt one of our missiles, if it was, we would have known. Just like the 2 missiles of ours that ended up in Iran some how.

Or unless medical supplies have been desperately needed because of the sanctions put in palce by (guess who) the US.
Hmm, I guess by US you meant UN? Yeah, because the sanctions are by the UN.

I remind you again that the sanctions were put in place by the US.
I remind you again, U.N. Also would like to remind you that the money spent on Saddam's palaces could feed his country and provide health care for all of his people and then some.

For all you know I could be a soldier too.
You sure could be. Your point?

LOADS of misfires (many of which landed in completely different countries) have occured.
1 missfire of a patriot hit and destroyed a british jet.
2 Tomahawks ended up in Iran and injured a couple people.
So far thats about it. There may be a couple that I havent heard of, but certainly not "LOADS." Until we get to Baghdad we wont be sure exactly how many missed... but very few is what I would expect based on accounts of people in the Red Cross and the Human Shields organization saying that they have not seen the massive civilian casulties that the Iraqi gov keeps claiming.

BS. You fight because your country is invaded. I would fight too, no matter what government was above me.
Open your fucking eyes.

I'll ask you this: if your family had to die in order to have "freedom", would you approve of it?
If my family was going to be killed if i did not defend a regime that does not allow freedom, I would pretend to defend saddam, then when I felt my family and I would be safe, I would surrender or turn sides.



Actually riki, she is a canadian. That information has been secretly encoded in almost all of her posts. Oh wait, you cant read.

[shade]

Serend, you are new to these boards so I believe a proper introduction is in order.

Rikimaru, this is Serendipity, a typical, nice american, that does not hate you or want to take over your country for oil or wage a holy war against your religion.

Serendipity, this is Rikimaru, a member of Al-Queda who would slit your throat if you didnt have your face covered. He would gladly stone you to death if you have any kind of "sexual" (even a kiss) contact with a man outside of marriage. He doesnt care that you are nice, he just knows you are an American. He thinks that by killing you, he will go to heaven.

[Serendipity]

Hmm, ok ...? Thanks?:confused:

[shade]

Just want to make sure you dont take his comments personally. Hes a complete idiot.

And, I noticed you are from san francisco... so... based on most of the protestors in san fran.. probably naive to evil like this man. Read his posts and see if you are still against this war.

[Serendipity]

WOW!! Now you attack me?? Because Iam from SF. And I am not on the side of the protesters here because they are interfering with other peoples daily lives...they are not protesters, they are mobs. Im for the freedom of mankind, but at the same time I hate war, but only because innocent children get hurt. And yes Iam well aware that freedom has its sacrafices. But I can still feel the way that I want. This is America still, no?
As for Riki...I care not for what he says. I take nothing personal, I know what forums are...so believe me I do not take it personal.

[shade]

Ah good you arent one of those mob lemmings. Welcome to the board then =).

Im for the freedom of mankind, but at the same time I hate war, but only because innocent children get hurt.
There is no freedom under saddam. 100s of thousands of children have starved, gone without medical treatment, or been orphaned under Saddam's rule because he spends money on palaces instead of food and health for his people.

Not to mention, more children died from him gasing Kurds and mass executing people in Basra after the Gulf War than have, or likely will (i hope) from this war, that will free Iraq from his rule.

Any child that dies in this war, any person for that fact, that is innocent, must be remembered for their sacrifice. Their deaths ensure the lives and freedom of millions in the future both in Iraq, and the USA. One could say that for every 1 dead innocent, that prevents 100-1000 (or more?) future innocent deaths. The needs of the many..

[Serendipity]

Again, I understand that....WAR has it sacrafices and I am well aware of what Saddam is doing and has done to the Iraqi people. I can still feel for the children....I say fuck the adults because they know what they are in for, but not those children.

As for a lemming..hell no. Truthfully those "protesters" are spending money we dont have here in the Bay...not to mention the man power. I joke with the husband that while those "protesters" are busy chanting away someones gonna blow up the Bay Bridge with them on it...just to tell them thanks!! Horrible to say that, but thats what will happen if they dont leave those boys to do their jobs....
And not mention letting them work on keeping the streets safer from our own criminals

[shade]

I think you are now my favorite person from San Fran other than my god parents and their kids. :)

[Serendipity]

thanks:D
I do not wish for anyone to dislike me....besides this is the internet and hell life is short Id rather have a nice clean debate instead of name calling....which is fun when its all in jest, but this forum I have to say takes the cake on verbal abuse! Whew...nuff said from me...now Im tried:D