English schools win right to ban Muslim veils

[Sobe]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17702262/

Good thing?

[melodeathpwns]

I don't think so.

[Thomson]

its not as if they're banning them all, its only if the teachers feel its a risk.

i back this 100%

[Viet Era Marine]

Sweet! It's about time.

Now we just need to work on the US PC crowd.


Regards,
VEM

[Kazimierz]

Just ban face coverings in general. It makes more sense and you don't have to target Muslims specifically. Because i'm sure its not just the hajji girl who is gonna be pissed off when i come to class wearing a ski mask.

[Viet Era Marine]

Just ban face coverings in general. It makes more sense and you don't have to target Muslims specifically. Because i'm sure its not just the hajji girl who is gonna be pissed off when i come to class wearing a ski mask.



Aw, they'd probably just be jealous.

[/Sillyness]

Actually that's not a bad idea. That way they have no 'Race Card'
to pull.

Good one Kaz.

Regards,
VEM

[Karly]

This is great IMO. We need to implement shit like this here in the US.

[Sketcher]

Anything that directly prohibits the faculty from identifying the student should be banned.

[Y2K_MASTER]

Anything that directly prohibits the faculty from identifying the student should be banned.

agreed

10chars?

[æcvfootball10æ]

good.................

[Spike Lee]

I'm glad I live in America were they do not allow such rediculous rules.

[Nocturnal]

OP, sure, they can deal

This is great IMO. We need to implement shit like this here in the US.


Not sure it's needed here?

[csite]

I dont get why women cover their face in the first place. It just makes men more curious of what they look like instead of having the opposit effect.

[Avo]

Are all you little kids or something, where are your heads. It's part of their religion, who cares if they wear a veil or not, let them be. Everyone has an excuse, a finger to point at, ignorant self-righteous individuals corrupt the good of things.

[whocares]

I dont get why women cover their face in the first place. It just makes men more curious of what they look like instead of having the opposit effect.
It's part of the religion you defend. You should know.
Are all you little kids or something, where are your heads. It's part of their religion, who cares if they wear a veil or not, let them be. Everyone has an excuse, a finger to point at, ignorant self-righteous individuals corrupt the good of things.
It depends. Everything has a limit. On the street and public places, sure, they can wear the veil that their religion suggests them to wear. However, on schools things are different. And one important thing to teachers and personel over there is to recognize their students. Wearing a veil just makes it difficult.

[Spike Lee]

If the veils are a problem, then that means they got more than veils to worry about. Let em be. I mean its disrespecful to insult their religion. PC or not.

[whocares]

^^ According to christians, it's disrespectful to them to ban school prayer as a policy. That does not mean that they have a right to it.

If they wanna pray during school, they can do it during break time. Teachers should not lead prayers, nor there should be school prayer.

Yet, they find that disrespectful. That means that the teachers should start leading prayers before class?

Of course not.

[OMFG FORUM RAGE]

its not as if they're banning them all, its only if the teachers feel its a risk.

i back this 100%

Totaly I do to those freaking sand rats.

[chalupa]

Totaly I do to those freaking sand rats.

^^^ Wha..? What the hell does "Totaly I do to those freaking sand rats" mean?


Anyway, this is an easy one. Full coverings should be banned. There is a safety risk here for not only the pupil (I laughed when I read the part about bunsen burners setting them on fire, btw), which I don't really give two shits about, but more importantly for everyone else in the school. The asshole that bombed the buses in London wore a full body cover, including face, and quite frankly, they cannot allow that kind of a risk in their schools.

Let them wear the hijab (head cover) as part of their religion, but going any further negatively impacts the other students. Draw the line there.

[Karly]

^^^ Wha..? What the hell does "Totaly I do to those freaking sand rats" mean?


Anyway, this is an easy one. Full coverings should be banned. There is a safety risk here for not only the pupil (I laughed when I read the part about bunsen burners setting them on fire, btw), which I don't really give two shits about, but more importantly for everyone else in the school. The asshole that bombed the buses in London wore a full body cover, including face, and quite frankly, they cannot allow that kind of a risk in their schools.

Let them wear the hijab (head cover) as part of their religion, but going any further negatively impacts the other students. Draw the line there.


speaking about the head cover- I HATE when i see these women wearing one for reasons of "religion" or "vanity" yet they wear an assload of makeup. wtf??

[Y2K_MASTER]

It's part of the religion you defend. You should know.


covering the face isn't part of the religion we defend.

[Nocturnal]

Are all you little kids or something, where are your heads. It's part of their religion, who cares if they wear a veil or not, let them be. Everyone has an excuse, a finger to point at, ignorant self-righteous individuals corrupt the good of things.

For safety reasons, identification, and yes even cultural reasons. It agitates me when people hide behind their nutty belief systems and it affects my way of life. If it is so critical to wear a veil, they should go to a private school, same deal with the school prayer crowd.

[blabam]

looks like we are winning the war on terror.

[Thomson]

as far as im aware, they don't HAVE to wear one. its more cultural than religious.

so i don't see what the big deal is.

i honestly think some of them do this just to piss us off.

[James Bond 007]

Im so glad, fuck them, if they arent happy they should fuck off to a country that doesnt mind kids going to school in Halloween costumes.

If we go to their country we have to abide by their strict rules and do as they do so when they are over here why should they think they shouldnt do as we do?
Did anyone hear about that arab bastard who was wanted in connection with the London tube bombings and he escaped out of the country by wearing one of these full body cloak things?

They look like characters from Star Wars, its about time this country put its foot down with them, Im sick and tired of the preferential treatment these people get, if I wanted to walk down the street in dark clothing wearing a balaclava how far do you think I would get before I was stopped by the police?

[chalupa]

It offends the Flying Spaghetti Monster if we do not wear full pirate regalia while talking about him. If someone asked me in school about the creator of the universe, I would have to go put on full pirate regalia...will they allow that? Of course not. I see no reason why Muslims should get preferential treatment.

[GotheriK]

Maybe the English DO have some common sense. I hope these trends continue.

[Spike Lee]

^^ According to christians, it's disrespectful to them to ban school prayer as a policy. That does not mean that they have a right to it.

If they wanna pray during school, they can do it during break time. Teachers should not lead prayers, nor there should be school prayer.

Yet, they find that disrespectful. That means that the teachers should start leading prayers before class?

Of course not.

But the teachers are not leading it.

[OMFG FORUM RAGE]

Anyway, this is an easy one. Full coverings should be banned. There is a safety risk here for not only the pupil (I laughed when I read the part about bunsen burners setting them on fire, btw), which I don't really give two shits about, but more importantly for everyone else in the school. The asshole that bombed the buses in London wore a full body cover, including face, and quite frankly, they cannot allow that kind of a risk in their schools.



hahaha bunsen burners lol

[deballedtomcat]

I see no reason why Muslims should get preferential treatment.

Probably because they have a marked tendency to blow things up and kill innocent peope when they don't get their way.

[csite]

It's part of the religion you defend. You should know.

Oooh your american, you should know every bit of your history too. Just because im iranian doesn't mean i know much about islam. But i did ask a guy and he said there is nothing in islam that says women should cover their whole face.

[droogsteve]

For safety reasons, identification, and yes even cultural reasons. It agitates me when people hide behind their nutty belief systems and it affects my way of life. If it is so critical to wear a veil, they should go to a private school, same deal with the school prayer crowd.


Watch it Noct, a couple of more posts like this and morons won't be able to automatically dismiss you as a bleeding heart liberal. ;)

I agree 100%. A kid certainly wouldn't be allowed to wear a ski mask in school all day, and this is no different. I don't give a shit how they do it in whatever medieval shithole they come from.

It's quite simple. The Islamic rules in Saudi Arabia are too oppressive for my liking. Solution? I won't go there. If I do, I have no right to bitch. If you can't abide by the rules of the UK or US, don't come here. Go someplace that has Sharia law, where you'll be comfortable. It's that easy.

[Nocturnal]

It offends the Flying Spaghetti Monster if we do not wear full pirate regalia while talking about him. If someone asked me in school about the creator of the universe, I would have to go put on full pirate regalia...will they allow that? Of course not. I see no reason why Muslims should get preferential treatment.

FSM only requires full pirate gear on tuesdays that have an odd date number, other occaisons you need only go about the world "freeball" or "commando" style.

Watch it Noct, a couple of more posts like this and morons won't be able to automatically dismiss you as a bleeding heart liberal. ;)


Hmm, point taken.

"These people are our guests, we should change our live to revolve around their belief systems. It's not our place to judge their culture, if they want to murder women for having pre-marital sex or being raped, whose to say we are any better" /relativist jackass

Is that better? ;)

[chalupa]

FSM only requires full pirate gear on tuesdays that have an odd date number, other occaisons you need only go about the world "freeball" or "commando" style.


I haven't worn underwear or boxers since 1999.

[Dayve]

I am in support of this 100%.

Here in our culture, we do not hide our faces, we do not dress like ninjas, we find it intimidating.

Especially intimidating if the people hiding what's under their ninja dresses are prone to blowing us up when they get pissed off.

[Meio]

One thing I have noticed is that Muslim women are not making a massive fuss about Muslim criminals using the veil to disguise themselves. It's the worse thing that can happen for the women that declare such dress as their right, that terrorists are evading police because of these womens insistance that such a disguise (and it is a disguise, that is the only intended purpose) is a right which must not be challenged.

Can anyone tell me the name of the first country to place restrictions on where coverings could be worn?

[avix123]

France???????

[Meio]

Turkey... thanks to Ataturk... anyone know what the predominent religion of the Turkish people is?

[Y2K_MASTER]

I am in support of this 100%.

Here in our culture, we do not hide our faces, we do not dress like ninjas, we find it intimidating.

Especially intimidating if the people hiding what's under their ninja dresses are prone to blowing us up when they get pissed off.

they can go to japan or china, then they can dress like ninjas, just hope the samurais don't see them :raiseeyeb

[OMFG FORUM RAGE]

where I live Muslims dont get refferled rights in the schools:raiseeyeb

[Meio]

Just thought I'd post this:

http://www.submission.org/teenagers/dress-teens.html

[Thomson]

Turkey... thanks to Ataturk... anyone know what the predominent religion of the Turkish people is?

Islam

10char

[chalupa]

no shit -- real website. http://www.hijabs-r-us.com/

Woohoo!

Also, check out the sexy burquini!!

http://www.ahiida.com/index.php?a=subcats&cat=20


If I ruled the Muslim world, I would decree that all woman had to wear shoes on their hands out of modesty. Anyone who didn't would get their feet cut off. It would be ironic.

[droogsteve]

Just thought I'd post this:

http://www.submission.org/teenagers/dress-teens.html


Quote from the link:

"Hijab" is the term used by many Muslims women to describe their head cover that may or may not include covering their face except their eyes, and sometimes covering also one eye.


Islam is getting too liberal! Allah's word is clear, yet you still sometimes see filthy whores with hajibs that expose both eyes!! No wonder rape victims are sometimes stoned to death for their wickedness in Islamic countries. Their slutty two-eyed Hajibs temp the poor helpless men, Praise Allah! How can they walk around with two exposed eyes and expect NOT to be raped, the vile sluts!!!!

[Bullet]

That's stupid.

If it's part of their religion, they have no right.

[OMFG FORUM RAGE]

nah I think its good if they bann em

[pers]

I dont have a comment on this move but if the british government thinks they are really liberating the british muslims and gaining support for muslims worldwide by such moves its nothing short of miscalculation.

[Meio]

The point is that it is not according to their religion but Arabian social tradition. Many muslims are not of Arabic descent or tradition, but insist that wearing such a disguise is their religious right all the same, just like a French Catholic insisting that it is a Catholic religious right to wear a black balaclava because Irish provos do... nonsense.

Some Muslim scholars insist that the Quaran tells women to cover up the shape of their tits and disguise the shape of their legs so that it is obvious that they are not a man without attracting undue attention from pervs. That is, those scholars that reject Hadith as not the Quaran and having no place in Sharia law other than as an agreed social convention.

[whocares]

I dont have a comment on this move but if the british government thinks they are really liberating the british muslims and gaining support for muslims worldwide by such moves its nothing short of miscalculation.
And why should the British government care about the support of those lunatics?

[Thomson]

I dont have a comment on this move but if the british government thinks they are really liberating the british muslims and gaining support for muslims worldwide by such moves its nothing short of miscalculation.

this is nothing to do with "liberating Muslims" or "gaining support".

if you would of read the article you'd realise its more than that.

[whocares]

this is nothing to do with "liberating Muslims" or "gaining support".

if you would of read the article you'd realise its more than that.
Exactly, it's about keeping things in order.

Sorry, but no face coverings in schools, teachers and the personel in there should not have any trouble recognizing the students, and likewise... muslims don't like it? ... great! they shouldn't give a fuck about it.

[Meio]

I dont have a comment on this move but if the british government thinks they are really liberating the british muslims and gaining support for muslims worldwide by such moves its nothing short of miscalculation.

So why aren't the Turks getting grief from the Isalmic world?

[bergshadow]

if the british government thinks they are really liberating the british muslims and gaining support for muslims worldwide by such moves its nothing short of miscalculation. I doubt that's much of a consideration any more.

It's a very strange battle to fight. The hijab makes no sense, especially in a northern climate or among Western cultures and economies. It's like the wool business suits the English wore in their tropical domains - essentially stupid, and a hassle. And if the approval of muslims worldwide is only to be gained by adopting stupidities and hassles, what is it worth?

[pers]

So why aren't the Turks getting grief from the Isalmic world?

Why do you think the turks want to join europe so badly and try to stick close to israel? I'd shed some light for you, the arabs don't really like the turks, the iranians certainly arn't too fond of the turks either.

And why should the British government care about the support of those lunatics?

Because if they don't your government will have less money and items would be more expensive.

this is nothing to do with "liberating Muslims" or "gaining support".

if you would of read the article you'd realise its more than that.

Nonsense, british muslims have lived in britain for decades the same way, they had no problems till events like 9-11, 7-7 and invasion of iraq!

If the teachers complained before 9-11 they seem to have been disregarded and if they didnt before why do it now?

The british government should stop hitting british muslims with laws they feel is undermining their identity and religion, it will have bad consequences, muslims already feel vulnerable as it is from the advertisements on tv about terrorists, suicide bombings and insurgents.

[Thomson]

If the teachers complained before 9-11 they seem to have been disregarded and if they didnt before why do it now?

yeah, 9-11 is one of the major issues here. the reason it was'nt a problem before 9-11 is because we didn't realise some Muslims want to kill us so bad. the vail is clearly a security issue.

and if they have lived in Britain for decades then why do they need to wear the vail? its already been mention several time that its NOT a religious requirement but more of a cultural thing. and since most of these Muslims we not born in an Arabic country, then its not apart of their culture is it?

everybody else safety should'nt be compromised just so some of these people can be a pain in the ass

[pers]

yeah, 9-11 is one of the major issues here. the reason it was'nt a problem before 9-11 is because we didn't realise some Muslims want to kill us so bad. the vail is clearly a security issue.

and if they have lived in Britain for decades then why do they need to wear the vail? its already been mention several time that its NOT a religious requirement but more of a cultural thing. and since most of these Muslims we not born in an Arabic country, then its not apart of their culture is it?

everybody else safety should'nt be compromised just so some of these people can be a pain in the ass

sikhs should also stop wearing their turbans on their heads and carrying their Kirpan (knifes)and jews can stop wearing their Kippahs. WHo knows, they could be hiding a bomb under there :rolleyes:

There is only one argument here and that teachers want to see their students face and thats fair enough, i think any parent who feels they have a problem with it can send their child to a muslim school or an all girls school.

But i think overall the british government isn't making being british and a young muslim any easier, force anyone into a corner they will lash out at you unpredictably.

[Meio]

sikhs should also stop wearing their turbans on their heads and carrying their Kirpan (knifes)and jews can stop wearing their Kippahs. WHo knows, they could be hiding a bomb under there :rolleyes:


As far as I understand it, British Sikhs recognised that carrying big fuck off knives around was not acceptable in Britain and stopped. There was a turban vs helmet thing, and I'm not sure what happened there in the end, but I don't see loads of Sikhs cruising round on bikes wearing turbans.

The 9/11 point is a good one... in my home town I never saw a woman wearing the full veil until after 9/11, and if I let on which my home town is you'd see why that is worthy of note (put it this way WASPs are possibly now no longer the majority). What does that tell us?

[hereyago]

good in my opinion

[Quick_Draw21]

Quote from the link:




Islam is getting too liberal! Allah's word is clear, yet you still sometimes see filthy whores with hajibs that expose both eyes!! No wonder rape victims are sometimes stoned to death for their wickedness in Islamic countries. Their slutty two-eyed Hajibs temp the poor helpless men, Praise Allah! How can they walk around with two exposed eyes and expect NOT to be raped, the vile sluts!!!!

Just to play devils advocate you do realize that that same attitude and mentality exists in the United States even now. When women dress very skimpy they are called sluts and whores. Imagine a woman walking around nude and got raped, would people be very sympathetic?

Of course since they are dressed in a way different then us, its easy to disparage them. Hell in the 40's wearing a bikini at the beach would probably have caused in uproar by conservative people. in the 20's wearing a short skirt and so on... The mentality is different and if its not harming anyone whats the problem?

However if their have been problems with veils then I can understand banning them but if its just more post 9/11 backlash like the patriot act (yes I know thats in the US) then I don't think its right no matter how you feel about that persons mentality.

[bergshadow]

However if their have been problems with veils then I can understand banning them In Saint Paul a couple years ago some local woman was denied entrance to a skyway bank unless she removed her face veil for the security cameras. She made a fuss and the police got involved - turned out she was a very recent convert to Islam, was wearing the only veil she owned, and had a police record of armed robbery.

I can see the face veil being banned in some areas of buildings. Beards? hmmm - - -

[Meio]

Turkey event went as far as to ban headscarves not just veils:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3513259.stm

[whocares]

Why do you think the turks want to join europe so badly and try to stick close to israel? I'd shed some light for you, the arabs don't really like the turks, the iranians certainly arn't too fond of the turks either.
ZZOMG! Conspiracy... :ahhh: :ahhh:

Because if they don't your government will have less money and items would be more expensive.
Which government exactly?

Well, it doesn't matter. You are wrong anyway. So, just because muslims have money does that mean that they have right to force their religion in schools? What kind of argument is that?

Imagine if jews were the ones that contributed most of the money to the british government and wanted to let their religion and politics to get into schools, overriding everything else? How would you feel?

Nonsense, british muslims have lived in britain for decades the same way, they had no problems till events like 9-11, 7-7 and invasion of iraq!

We'll just say that those tragic events made British people realize that Islam is taking over their country and laws.

They had no problems because the government over there was bending over them and their cultural and religious beliefs.

If the teachers complained before 9-11 they seem to have been disregarded and if they didnt before why do it now?

Because they are realizing that muslims aren't really that peaceful at all. Some mosques over the UK do preach hate against other religions!

Anyway, they could also be doing it because they don't want students hiding their face.


And just because they didn't ask for it before, or it was denied before, does not mean that it's wrong.

The british government should stop hitting british muslims with laws they feel is undermining their identity and religion, it will have bad consequences,
Stop you nonsense! Those laws aren't made for undermining their identity or religion. If they feel like that... then THAT'S TOO BAD!

And what bad consequences will have? Bombings, terrorism? If it is, then there's no case with caring about the feelings of those dipshits.

muslims already feel vulnerable as it is from the advertisements on tv about terrorists, suicide bombings and insurgents.
Great! They should go and complain to radical islamists which are the ones causing terrorism and suicide bombings... and thus give them that bad image.

Oh wait a moment!!! Why do muslims feel vulnerable about it? Because Islam is really a terrorist religion or at best, a real intolerant religion? Why do they feel vulnerable of that?
sikhs should also stop wearing their turbans on their heads and carrying their Kirpan (knifes)and jews can stop wearing their Kippahs. WHo knows, they could be hiding a bomb under there :rolleyes:
On schools? Yeah!! Why not?

But i think overall the british government isn't making being british and a young muslim any easier, force anyone into a corner they will lash out at you unpredictably.
It's not like they are gonna prosecute and jail someone for being a muslim.

[Meio]

On schools? Yeah!! Why not?


Indeed, and remember that they haven't just banned the veil like the turks, but have said that if a school thinks there is a health and safety issue they can ban religious garb (of any kind).

[Asbestos Crayon]

It doesn't really make any difference any ways. Girls that are not married are only required to wear a head covering and not a veil. And as we all know, those who wish to take shia law to extrem can always wear a see through veil. But those guys usually want their women in a potato sack anyways.

[OMFG FORUM RAGE]

It doesn't really make any difference any ways. Girls that are not married are only required to wear a head covering and not a veil. And as we all know, those who wish to take shia law to extrem can always wear a see through veil.

thats true

[bergshadow]

. And as we all know, those who wish to take shia law to extrem How did this suddenly become a Shia matter, rather than a Muslim issue generally?

[OMFG FORUM RAGE]

How did this suddenly become a Shia matter, rather than a Muslim issue generally?

allah works in mysterious ways

/sarcasm

[Meio]

How did this suddenly become a Shia matter, rather than a Muslim issue generally?

Well because a devout muslim aims to submit to the word of allah in every aspect of life, a muslim state enacting muslim laws is the position aimed for.