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kevinsmith
04-03-2007, 08:45 PM
This is interesting, never thought of this. I always thought of this solution as one of the better ones.


WASHINGTON (AFP) - The boom in ethanol fuels in the United States and elsewhere could have devastating effects on food prices and worsen world hunger, a new study argues.
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The study by C. Ford Runge and Benjamin Senauer of the University of Minnesota said the rush into ethanol threatens to divert massive amounts of corn and other food crops into biofuels.

The researcher write in the May/June edition of Foreign Affairs that governments should stop incentives for ethanol until biofuels can be economically produced from sources other than corn and soybeans.

"Resorting to biofuels is likely to exacerbate world hunger," they said. "Several studies by economists at the
World Bank and elsewhere suggest that caloric consumption among the world's poor declines by about half of one percent whenever the average prices of all major food staples increase by one percent."

The researchers said the surge in energy prices along with subsidies and incentives given by governments has pushed farmers into diverting massive amounts of corn, oilseeds and other crops into ethanol.

In the US, this affects corn, but in Brazil it involves sugar cane and in Africa cassava.

"If, all other things being equal, the prices of staple foods increased because of demand for biofuels, the number of food-insecure people in the world would rise by over 16 million for every percentage increase in the real prices of staple foods," they wrote.

"That means that 1.2 billion people could be chronically hungry by 2025 -- 600 million more than previously predicted."

They said the biofuel craze could push up corn prices 20 percent by 2010 and 41 percent by 2020. This could affect other crops such as rice or wheat, since farmers are converting their fields to corn or other plants more profitable because of their potential for ethanol.

"In the United States, the growth of the biofuel industry has triggered increases not only in the prices of corn, oilseeds, and other grains but also in the prices of seemingly unrelated crops and products," they said.

"The use of land to grow corn to feed the ethanol maw is reducing the acreage devoted to other crops. Food processors who use crops such as peas and sweet corn have been forced to pay higher prices to keep their supplies secure, costs that will eventually be passed on to consumers."

The authors said the ethanol market is further distorted by subsidies that make diversion of crops even more profitable.

"Rather than promoting more mandates, tax breaks, and subsidies for biofuels, the US government should make a major commitment to substantially increasing energy efficiency in vehicles, homes, and factories; promoting alternative sources of energy, such as solar and wind power; and investing in research to improve agricultural productivity and raise the efficiency of fuels derived from cellulose," the authors said.

Viet Era Marine
04-03-2007, 08:55 PM
Gee, I wonder who funded this study?
Mobil, Exxon, Shell?

Knoodle
04-03-2007, 09:09 PM
We need to stop using Middle Eastern oil by any means possible. Ethanol is one way but I think harnessing ocean currents would be much better. There's an endless amount of clean energy in ocean currents.

We can't keep enabling people who want to dominate us (Muslims) by giving them so much of our money. Once we quit buying their oil they should revert to being nomads attacking desert carvans for their booty.

Quick_Draw21
04-03-2007, 09:21 PM
What ever happened to those hydrogen powered cars that could harness energy by splitting the hydrogen atoms from the oxygen in water


We need to stop using Middle Eastern oil by any means possible. Ethanol is one way but I think harnessing ocean currents would be much better. There's an endless amount of clean energy in ocean currents.

We can't keep enabling people who want to dominate us (Muslims) by giving them so much of our money. Once we quit buying their oil they should revert to being nomads attacking desert carvans for their booty.

lol you do realize that arabs only account for 11% of muslims

alex_de_large
04-03-2007, 09:22 PM
wave of the future here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusion_reactor

bergshadow
04-03-2007, 09:29 PM
Abusing agricultural land to produce gasoline substitute has a lot of problems, including the obvious one: it would take the entire agricultural output of the US to make a real dent in consumption, and that's without counting fertilizer etc.

Short run: higher gas mileage, less driving, mass transit, ethanol from something other than corn.

Longer run: Sterling cycle heat engines for electrical generation and plugin hybrid cars.

Knoodle
04-03-2007, 09:30 PM
What ever happened to those hydrogen powered cars that could harness energy by splitting the hydrogen atoms from the oxygen in water




lol you do realize that arabs only account for 11% of muslims

That 11% is what scares me. We pay them big bucks for some black goo and they thank us by jihadding all over the place and waging war against 'crusaders & jews'. No thanks.

alex_de_large
04-03-2007, 09:32 PM
What ever happened to those hydrogen powered cars that could harness energy by splitting the hydrogen atoms from the oxygen in water

One prototype is being developed by GM right now. I believe you are referring to hydrogen fuel cells?

Nocturnal
04-04-2007, 10:17 AM
This is interesting, never thought of this. I always thought of this solution as one of the better ones.

Corn is very inefficient at producing ethanol, it only offers something like a 2-1 ratio of energy input to output. The issue becomes even worse when you consider that it is a food crop, sugarcane is only mildly better.

Switchgrass appears to offer 8-1 energy output, and does not have to grow in the same fields where we normally make food. The problem is that we have a huge corn industry in the US, they desperately want us to switch to corn ethanol.

In any case the future is likely to offer a blend of options, generaly better MPG cars, hybrid vehicles, and flexible fuel.

For instance well designed hybrid vehicle and can be plugged in for extended charges and can run on E85 would be amazing. You could rely on your home power grid for your daily commute, and only fire up the E85 engine when you needed that extra power to take the quick trip to the beach.

GlutSow
04-04-2007, 11:22 AM
Why can't people just grow their own corn?

Viet Era Marine
04-04-2007, 07:49 PM
Corn is very inefficient at producing ethanol, it only offers something like a 2-1 ratio of energy input to output. The issue becomes even worse when you consider that it is a food crop, sugarcane is only mildly better.

Switchgrass appears to offer 8-1 energy output, and does not have to grow in the same fields where we normally make food. The problem is that we have a huge corn industry in the US, they desperately want us to switch to corn ethanol.

In any case the future is likely to offer a blend of options, generaly better MPG cars, hybrid vehicles, and flexible fuel.

For instance well designed hybrid vehicle and can be plugged in for extended charges and can run on E85 would be amazing. You could rely on your home power grid for your daily commute, and only fire up the E85 engine when you needed that extra power to take the quick trip to the beach.



Well, it's not that the corn growers are looking to Ethanol as a savior. It's just that ANY value added to the base price of the grain helps. I also have to wonder about this: When ethanol is extracted, does it kill off the food value in the corn? Somehow I doubt it. I know for a fact that once ethanol is extracted you still have a very high percentage of the Biiomass left to manufacture other products from.

Example: ADM in Cedar Rapids extracts Ethanol, Corn Suryp and Corn Oil from the Base Corn. They then ship the Biomass to Penford Products, who then extract solids like adhesives. After that, the Biomass is still good as an additive to livstock feeds.

So, my question would be; "Does 'Switchgrass' have the same potential?