Russia warned U.S. about Iraqi terrorism

[Bugfatty]

CNN (http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/europe/06/18/russia.warning/index.html)

This was never included in Bush's case against Iraq.

[Fossil]

Putin is an EX KGB chief who is currently trying to bring back the glory days of Stalin by silencing anyone who might disagree with him. That doesn't necessarily negate the truth of the above link, but it means I'm going to need more than his "good" word before I believe him.


Maybe if Putin would care to release some more information, details, or specifics targets the Iraqis were planning to attack, then I'd take him seriously.

[shade]

That doesn't necessarily negate the truth of the above link Of course it doesnt, because he was against the war. Therefor, it would not be logical for him to say that Iraq planned terrorist attacks against us. It would make sense for him to say Iraq was harmless.

I cant help but recall the repeated statement with the jist of "We can not let Iraq become an imminent threat."

This would also happen to contribute to the "protecting russia and/or china for supplying iraq" theory. Perhaps in the 90s Russia supplied Iraq officially or unofficially (bribery, corruption) with materials for wmd. When Putin realised the severity of 9/11, and how bad it would be if an Iraqi wmd traced back to Russian equipment, decided to cut losses and give intel to the US. We dont need another cold war.

[Viceroy]

Putin is an EX KGB chief who is currently trying to bring back the glory days of Stalin by silencing anyone who might disagree with him.

Killing 30 million Russians and purging the NKVD? I think that's beyond Putin.

[Liberator13]

lol viceroy this is pry the 1 time ill agree with u... that was a great line

[Fossil]

Killing 30 million Russians and purging the NKVD? I think that's beyond Putin.

Between Chechnya, his handling of the Russian media and his critics, I'd say he's off to a great start.

[Asbestos Crayon]

Fossil you would have a point except for one problem. Putin still will not acknowledge the war was legitimate. What I don't get is he says this. We knew about it. We know by CIA accounts, French Intel accounts, and Mussad accounts that Iraq was speaking to Al-Queda in Germany before 9-11. No one knows what was said in the meeting, but every one of these intellegence agencies conclude Al-Queda was making proposals to Iraq for assistence in attacking the US. Given previouse attacks on USS Cole, Kenya and Tanzania, Saddam should have known to just talk to Al-Queda was suicide. The old USSR would have invaded countries for less and Putin took the side he did. $50 billion in oil exports must have been more attractive.

[Viceroy]

Between Chechnya, his handling of the Russian media and his critics, I'd say he's off to a great start.

If it were Stalin, Chechnya would no longer exist, there would be no Russian media (besides Pravda) and anyone reckless enough to criticise him would be shipped off to Siberia in no time.

People who compare Putin to Stalin obviously have no accurate idea of the scale of events under Stalin.

[Bugfatty]

but it means I'm going to need more than his "good" word before I believe him.

Its more than Putin. Bush personally thanked the members of the Russian Special Services who passed the information.

[Ironhorse]

"I can confirm that after the events of September 11, 2001, and up to the military operation in Iraq, Russian special services and Russian intelligence several times received ... information that official organs of Saddam's regime were preparing terrorist acts on the territory of the United States and beyond its borders, at U.S. military and civilian locations," Putin said.

If this is true then why wouldn't Russia have supported the U.S.'s goals in Iraq? At least morally for the benefit of world opinion. Russia's decision to oppose the war sent a "strong" message throughout the world that "credible evidence" of Iraq being linked to terror against the U.S. did not exist. Now Putin says that actually there was evidence? :confused: Was Russia's agenda to weaken the U.S. financially and to weaken our resolve to strengthen their own position. To take steps to regain their place among the superpowers?

[shade]

Oil for food.

[Fossil]

People who compare Putin to Stalin obviously have no accurate idea of the scale of events under Stalin.

And I don't believe that you have any accurate idea of what is happening in Russia today.

[shade]

Yeah... they have mcdonalds now. The horror..... the horror...

[poopchow]

All i can say is i wish more people knew about this.

[shade]

I cant help but notice the lack of response to this by the anti iraq people.

Or the lack of response to http://forum.ebaumsworld.com/showthread.php?t=19676

[poopchow]

I just hope droog and viceroy can see them

[Ironhorse]

Oil for food.

Please explain.

[shade]

The communist party of Russia profited immensely from oil for food in the order of about $1,000,000,000. On a governmental scale that may not sound like much considering the US budget is 1000 times that. However, in the form of bribes to important people, $1,000,000,000 can go a very long way. And those people would not want to be found out, in the case of maybe, the US invading and finding records.

[Ironhorse]

Well, your damn skippy its not much money (at least as far as governments are concerned). I am even surprised these countries - France, Syria, Russia - would risk the worldwide humiliation of being involved with these "agreements" with Saddam for such an insignificant amount of money. However, if they were so blinded by the kickbacks they were getting through the oil for food program then there should be consequences for their actions (i.e. fines, probations). Thats why I find it hard to belive that the kickbacks they were recieving played a part in their decision to oppose the war.

I believe they didn't believe there was sufficient evidence of a WMD program in Iraq. Now we all know that even if Iraq did have a WMD program, it certainly wasn't a very significant one. We also know that their WMD program more than likely ended in the early 90's and the things that have been found are just remnants of that program.

If we went to Iraq because Russia had warned that Iraq had been planning an attack against the U.S. then that is the story that should have been presented from the outset. Instead, President Bush chose the WMD story and that has proven to be a mistake. It was NOT a "slam dunk case".

I don't even think that President Bush had bad intentions by starting this war without the support of 3 very significant members from the U.N. I actually believe his intentions may have been good. However, he and his administration have changed their story about reasons for this war depending on which evidence confronts them. That makes the rush to war an issue.

War is a last ditch decision when all other decisions have failed and you better be sure of the reasons you go to war or there will be strong opposition to the war. Because he has been deceitful about the reasons for war, he should step down as president of the U.S. If he doesn't step down, I will do my part with my vote to force him to step down.

[disturbed2]

fucking shit, i dont want another terror attack here, i still cant get over 9-11. and if any of you fucks say boo hoo, i knew 3 people who died in that shit and one was a fireman. up yours :mad:

[Ironhorse]

Intelligent comeback. And just the sort of fear mongering the Bush administration has sought to inflict on the American people and the world. I refuse to live my life in fear and to cast my vote out of fear.

[shade]

I am even surprised these countries - France, Syria, Russia - would risk the worldwide humiliation of being involved with these "agreements" with Saddam for such an insignificant amount of money. $1,000,000,000 can go a very very long way with bribing at the individual level. Saddam did not give the money directly to the governments. He gave it to important people in them either directly to the officials, to financiers of the officials, or to the political party of the official.

A $1,000,000,000 donation to the French government wouldnt do shit. But a few 3-50 million $ "gifts" to important individuals, can go a very long way. Those individuals also would not want to be found out, and therefor, would certainly be against an invasion or Iraq. In order for someone to be like that, they would have to be an extremely greedy ethical egoist. Well, they took the blood money, so they probably are.

Now we all know that even if Iraq did have a WMD program, it certainly wasn't a very significant one. Well, I personally know otherwise. But even that aside, the knowledge that the scientists have is just as dangerous if the Iraqi government was involved with Al Queda, which the CIA believes according to the other topic I have running about the link. You dont need a football stadium of equipment to make enough sarin to kill thousands of people - indeed, it could be done in a cave.

[disturbed2]

Intelligent comeback. And just the sort of fear mongering the Bush administration has sought to inflict on the American people and the world. I refuse to live my life in fear and to cast my vote out of fear.
its not a comeback, i didnt even read your post, im just pissed off right now because so many people that i loved died, i can count 12, and im not even old enough to drive.

[Ironhorse]

I know that if an American governmental official had been found out to be taking bribes he'd be drug through the court of personal opinion before he could write the deposit slip. Why isn't this same scrutiny taking place in France and Russia? That brings up the question of doubt that it was individuals that actually profited from these bribes. Instead, likely it was the governments of these countries. These countries should be fined an amount equal to 10 times the amount they profited from the bribes payable to the UN to distribute more food. I do know I am tired of hearing frenchmen in this forum being so critical of my country while lending a blind eye to the problems in their own country.

If Bush had taken the time to prove his points were based on facts, he wouldn't be in the situation he is in with a nation divided over this issue. He also may not be locked into a tight race to keep his job. I believe we should NEVER go to war without the support of ALL of the charter members of the UN. Period.

[shade]

Why isn't this same scrutiny taking place in France and Russia? Lol. Because they are corrupt! Especially Russia.

Instead, likely it was the governments of these countries. I have lost the list, but the governments werent on it. They were mostly given to organisations with close ties to the government. It would be like Exxon getting illegal oil kickbacks, then using that money to go beyond the typical lobbyist schmoozing of a congressmen.

If Bush had taken the time to prove his points were based on facts, he wouldn't be in the situation he is in with a nation divided over this issue. Perhaps that is why all this new information that dates back to 2001 is being released before the election. He made the case to go to Iraq well enough, considering at the height, 78% of the country was in favor of going to Iraq. Only now that the dust is settling has the nation become divided. Therefor, release more solid information that the politicians used in their decision to go to Iraq so the general public has less regrets before election time. Makes sense.

I believe we should NEVER go to war without the support of ALL of the charter members of the UN. Period. Thats the problem. What if the charter members are profiteering.

[Ironhorse]

Here's the article including recipients (http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110004667) from the Wallstreet Journal.

[Liberator13]

Well, I personally know otherwise. But even that aside, the knowledge that the scientists have is just as dangerous if the Iraqi government was involved with Al Queda, which the CIA believes according to the other topic I have running about the link. You dont need a football stadium of equipment to make enough sarin to kill thousands of people - indeed, it could be done in a cave.

Thank you!! I did a research paper (almost 15 pages lol) about biological terrorism, and i spent at least 3 pages on the iraqi biological weapon manufacturing. After the USSR fell, hundreds of biochemists went to just iraq alone and were given almost unlimited fundin by saddam

i dont remember when exactly this happened, but US special forces found 25 missiles (NOT scuds) that had been modified to accept custom biological warheads with about 30-40 of these warheads, we have also found a few models of RPGs that had almost no explosives but instead had strands of yellowfever and sarin.

when ken alibek (sp??) defected to the US, he said that some of his closest associates had gone directly to iraq with all of their knowledge and equipment

this was just BIOLOGICAL weapons, not nuclear or chemical, who knows what kind of programs saddam had with those

[shade]

i dont remember when exactly this happened, but US special forces found 25 missiles (NOT scuds) that had been modified to accept custom biological warheads Yup I remember that too. The missiles had mixing canisters to facilitate Sarin gas, which is so dangerous that the binary chemicals are mixed in flight en route to the target.

It was on the news for like one day, then just brushed aside under the table. Gotta love the liberal news media establishment.

I cant even find articles on the internet about it anymore. When I google for the likely words, I get thousands of unrelated responses. I think they were Al Samoud 2's with the illegal range and the sarin canisters (without sarin).

[Liberator13]

u remember when that happened? i cant even remember if it was before 9/11, durin the gulf war, after the gulf war, i jus remember that

[shade]

I think it was early in the current Iraq war; at least the missiles designed to use Sarin. I think they are in the David Kay report or something. I saw pictures of it on the news..

[Liberator13]

yea id never actually seen it in the news, i read it in an article i found online, and there were maybe 3 sentences in the entire article about it, but i thoguht it was pretty damn important

[Ironhorse]

BANNED MISSILES FOUND IN IRAQ April 2, 2003 (http://www.centcom.mil/CENTCOMNews/news_release.asp?NewsRelease=20030421.txt)
UN team finds Iraq has illegal missiles (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0%2C2763%2C894550%2C00.html)
Iraq vows to cooperate on prohibited missiles (http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/02/18/sprj.irq.un.iraq/)

I don't know if these are the missiles you are refering to or not. If it is then it surely doesn't represent an advanced WMD program and definitely not enough to go to war over.

[shade]

Yeah those were found before the war. After the war started we found a cache of missiles made to facilitated chemical warheads.

I think we also found some remote control planes not unlike our predators, but with apparatus designed to spray a mist of chemicals.

[Ironhorse]

Poison missiles found by G.I.s (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wn_report/story/73665p-68162c.html)
The smoking gun (http://www.command-post.org/archives/004452.html)

These 20 missiles were never confirmed for whatever reason.

[Liberator13]

Ironhorse i think thats it, i read it in an actual report written about biological terrorism, so it didnt have some details yours did, but i think u found it


and i completely forgot about the RC weapons, lol ty shade, we found 3 different models of these, 4 planes in total
the first model actually worked (tested with harmless substances.... durr) but im(?) guessin that since they had so little "spray range" and used too much of the agent, they made at least 2 more attempts at them, the last 1 was much more efficient than the other 2 models, and only findin 1 of the most advanced model and 2 of the models between the least and most advanced worries me

[shade]

These 20 missiles were never confirmed for whatever reason. I bet they werent ;)

BTW, you have much skill in the news searching!

[BigPoop]

Since when do the Iraqis have anything to do with terrorism?

[Liberator13]

.... well, it may jus be me, but isnt it common sense that a leader like saddam would harbor/help terrorists? maybe not al quaeda... but others... but this country lacks common sense so it doesnt suprise me

[poopchow]

Since when do the Iraqis have anything to do with terrorism?

why arent you banned