show me the law

[Chewy]

I read this awhile ago and thought it was pretty interesting.

http://www.papersplease.org/gilmore/facts.html

Where is the law saying that you have to show ID to get on a plane?


Gilmore's case is about one thing: the right to travel.

The court will have to determine the answers to two very important questions:

• Do citizens currently need to show ID in order to travel in their own country?
• If the answer is 'yes', is this constitutional?
We know that nowadays, travelers are constantly being required to show their ID. John Gilmore wasn't able to fly on Independence Day 2002 because he would not produce identification. ID is now required to board planes, trains, buses, and even cruise ships. These ID demands prevent travel by Americans who will not show their "papers". Is such a requirement constitutional?

Many Americans incorrectly assume that our right to travel anonymously has been legally suspended by the USA Patriot Act. This is not true: the USA Patriot Act contains no such provision.

The right to travel involves a number of constitutional issues:
The 1st Amendment
Physical travel and the First Amendment are inextricably intertwined. If you can't travel, then how can you exercise your right to Assemble? You can't Associate either, because you won't be able to get anywhere. Your right to Free Speech is also affected. You can say what you want, just not at that conference you wanted to attend but couldn't because you weren't allowed to get on a plane.
The 4th Amendment
Refusing a government "request" for ID triggers a severe penalty, such as loss of free movement. And lest we forget, having to show your ID is a search without a warrant.


Thankfully, the United States of America has no national ID card. We have no 'papers' to show. How can we as citizens be forced to produce something on demand that we aren't required to have in the first place?

In this court case, the core issue of our right to travel has been obscured by other side issues, secret law being the most outrageous of them.
Secret Law
Secret law is an abomination. There is no published statute or regulation requiring traveler identification. The airlines and the federal government insist that federal law requires passengers to show identification, yet can point to no published source of that requirement.

The government can argue all they want that it's the airlines that are 'requesting' ID, but the bottom line is that the violation of constitutional rights can't be out-sourced.

[Nocturnal]

I'm a huge privacy advocate, but in that case I suppose you could say that it is the airlines right to not let you board their planes if you don't have proper ID.

Now if you are just walking around and the cops demand your ID, that is different.

[Ace Hippie]

You have a right to travel, but not a right to fly on a plane. The ID policy is merely an extremely reasonable system used by the company to decide who can or cannot travel on their planes. So long as the process isn't discriminatory or violating other laws (which it does not), there's nothing wrong with it.

[vchampionl70]

I believe, though am guessing here, that this is stgipulated in the PATRIOT ACT.

[Chewy]

I believe, though am guessing here, that this is stgipulated in the PATRIOT ACT.
well there is no law in the books.


As it turns out, there may be no such law on the books. Instead, carefully worded rules and statements allow airlines to make it seem that way. Under current federal regulations, they're only required to ask for ID, not to make it a condition of travel.

http://www.wired.com/news/privacy/0,1848,54464,00.html

some stuff here is kind of interesting.

http://freetotravel.org/

[American Infidel]

In these days that follow September 11th, I believe the unoffending citizens of America should consider these regulations as a necessary inconvenience. After all, it's intent is their safety.

One thing I'd never heard of is that, when demanded to see identification, it's termed as "illegal search and seizure". What about when you're pulled over for speeding and the officer asks to see your driver's license?

[Bergs]

It doesnt matter that there is no law on the books. A private company, whether it be an airline, train, bus, or cruiseline has the right to refuse service to anybody that wont comply to their company rules. If they want identification they have every right to ask for it.

[gigatonblast]

I used to be against seat belt laws...


Why would my government make ME wear a seat belt ?

Then my widdle head busted a windshield.


Hey you up there ;) ....Its really stupid to drive with the headlights on at noon isnt it ? :lol: *hint hint*

UPDATE: 2 1300 ft buildings going SPLAT all over Manhattan did it for me....
ID ? YES SIR !!


Full cavity search....Yes mam !

[droogsteve]

An airport is a secure area. By entering such an area, you're agreeing to give up certain rights. Obviously a cop can't just search my bag or tell me to empty my pockets on the street, but when I enter the secure area of the airport, I'm giving tacit consent to submit to these things. Showing proper ID is no different. If you don't want to show ID, you're choosing not to enter the secure area.

From a liability point of view, the airlines would be crazy not to demand ID even if the government didn't request it. As we all know, the airlines were sued for billions by 9/11 families for their lax security's role in the attacks. The cases are still pending. Not demanding ID would open them up to billions in additional liability suits should another incident take place.

[Bergs]

And as far as a traffic stop goes, in order to operate a motor vehicle you have to be properly licensed. If you are stopped for a violation a cop has probable cause to see your license.

[TFS]

It's just a thing to make sure that the name on the ticket is the one that matches your face, in case someone carelessly sets down their boarding pass and someone else seizes the opportunity. When they go into the scure area, they have a ticket with a name on it that does not match the one on their ID, and that is reason for concern about safety.