MPAA destroying torrent sites...

[andreinstein]

What's your opinion about the MPAA destroying torrent sites?
I live in Hungary, and i really love for example, Family Guy. How can i view them if it's not avaliable in my country?
They destroyed TvTorrents, Btefnet, now Elitetorrents...
I mean it's not fair! They don't make money from television shows! Just commercials...and we don't download those. So what's the big deal about?
Thanks for reading. :(

[droogsteve]

Actually, they do make money off of TV shows. You mentioned Family Guy, all Family Guy episodes are available on DVD.

There are still some good torrent sites, Torrent Reactor for example. Here are some Family Guy (http://www.torrentreactor.net/sections.php?id=138) torrents for you. Enjoy. :)

[andreinstein]

Actually, they do make money off of TV shows. DVD.

Thanks for the link!
Now, the DVD is another thing. But something what is not released widely, just on tv, is not a succes on it's own. 35% of the tv shows is not released on dvd, i think, very good ones are released, like South Park, Futurama, Simpsons, Family Guy, Friends, Shield etc.

[reptilian_storm]

There so many ways of sharing files and lots more ideas to come that no matter how hard they try they will never end piracy online.

IRCSpy.
Torrents.
Peer to Peer.

Out of those 3 which i used IRCSpy is the bar far the best and poses the biggest threat towards artists and software developers. Allmost every file on the IRCSpy networks download at full speed without the need to upload but it is one of the harder ones to use.

Why do people not have a go at taking down the IRC networks that files are supplied on?

Most of the Warez you find online nowadays comes originally from IRC but instead of stopping it at the source they try and shut down peer to peer networks and bitorrent sites.

It makes no sense to me at all.

[ZX-6RR]

Torrentspy will always be my one and only torrent love. I don't see that going away any time soon. There is no way that I can go back to a crappy P2P network, like Gnutella, after downloading whole CDs and everything else on BT.

But, the MPAA has every right to be doing what they're doing. Let's face it, people but thousands of dollars/hours into things such music/movies/apps, whatever. I mean, how would you like it if half of the release of your new movie was being distributed for free to people jasking it off of a P2P network.

I don't use mine too often, just if there's something that I really want, or if it's something I can't live without. I know, it's wrong and I shouldn't do it, but, free music is just too hard to pass up sometimes.

[mgunit]

They'll never stop IRC, it's always been the best, and always will be.

All of the torrent sites will begin to fold under pressure. You can already see this on www.torrentspy.com try searching for family guy and see what slaps you in the face.

If they start doing that for everyone that contacts them, they'll be down in a month.


The only torrent sites that'll survive are the ones based overseas.

[Armed&Angry]

Sharing is caring. :D

Fuck the MPAA

[dead]

They'll never stop IRC, it's always been the best, and always will be.

All of the torrent sites will begin to fold under pressure. You can already see this on www.torrentspy.com try searching for family guy and see what slaps you in the face.

If they start doing that for everyone that contacts them, they'll be down in a month.


The only torrent sites that'll survive are the ones based overseas.
yeah my favorite one is located in russia :)

[Kommercial]

They can shutdown all they want, piracy will still happen, probably at a higher rate.

[TFS]

They don't make money from commercials alone. No one would watch TV if it were all commercials. Do you ever plan your schedule around that new infomercial that's airing Saturday night? The commercials pay for advertising space during the most watched shows. If you can download all the best series to watch at your leisure, there's no demand for you to watch TV networks, then with viewers leaving, the advertisers will pull their commercials, causing the networks to lose money.

That's MPAA is shutting down toerrents. They make the networks lose advertising money.

[Dontdropthesoad]

What the downloaders are doing is 100% wrong! I mean seri...

oh shit sorry i just finished downloading star wars III

[PotIsYourFriend]

I think all Torrents should be shutdown.... Along with all P2P programs... Get a job so you can afford shit.....

[TFS]

I think all Torrents should be shutdown.... Along with all P2P programs... Get a job so you can afford shit.....
Coming from a pot-head too...

That's just fucking hilarious.

[PsiRedEye22]

People like to pick and choose their morality. It makes them look like a hero and a rebel at the same time, but real people just see them as tools and hypocrites.

[droogsteve]

I think all Torrents should be shutdown.... Along with all P2P programs... Get a job so you can afford shit.....


PotIsYourFriend is against a minor violation of the law.

Gotta love the irony deficient.

[Armed&Angry]

I think all Torrents should be shutdown.... Along with all P2P programs... Get a job so you can afford shit.....
I heard weed kills braincells, that true?

[Kommercial]

I think all Torrents should be shutdown.... Along with all P2P programs... Get a job so you can afford shit.....

I have a job, but I'll be damned if I'm going to pay $600 for Photoshop.

[Dontdropthesoad]

uh hello star wars three isn't on dvd yet.

Sheesh some people.

Actually to be honest i would rather pay for the DVD instead of wait 1235125 hours for my download.

Movies should come out simultaneously with the dvds

[Smoothy]

torrent sites own for downloading full CDs :)... if they shut them down there will ALWAYS be something after
Just look at the past with napster.. kazaa... they get shutdown... sharing just increases and always will

[TFS]

I don't download. The only three downloaded things I have are AIM, a free song download I got from a bank advertisement scheme (used it on Tom Petty's "Mary Jane's Last Dance"-pure bliss) and that fake version of "Oops I Did It Again" by Sachmo. I have no need to download anything, especially illegal stuff, just because I get along fine without it. In fact, I prefer all the extra shit that comes with the DVD and the CD I buy at Best Buy.

But I understand other people feel differently. I got nothing for or against it, it just isn't something that matters either way to me.

But there is no reason for them to bitch about their source of illegal material getting shut down. That's like a bully getting pissy over being caught giving wedgies.

Your source gets closed off, quit bitching about it and find another. I got no sympathy just because you know before-hand that what you're doing is frowned upon by the authorities. You should be happy it took them that long to shut it down. It comes with the territory of trading illegal material.

[dead]

uh hello star wars three isn't on dvd yet.

Sheesh some people.

Actually to be honest i would rather pay for the DVD instead of wait 1235125 hours for my download.

Movies should come out simultaneously with the dvds
maybe getting cable is a option i had mine copy of star wars 3 within a day.

[JerkyMyTurky]

Here are a couple articles by someone who claims piracy is having beneficial effects...

Piracy is good? Part One by Mark Pesce (http://www.mindjack.com/feature/piracy051305.html)
Piracy is good? Part Two by Mark Pesce (http://www.mindjack.com/feature/newlaws052105.html)

[PotIsYourFriend]

Coming from a pot-head too...

That's just fucking hilarious.


How? That really makes no sense...

[Armed&Angry]

How? That really makes no sense...
Weed really does kill braincells... :rolleyes:
He saying it's funny because you're against this because it's illegal and telling us to get a job, but potheads are notoriously lazy and weed is illegal. It never ceases to amaze me how stupider people are getting.

[Dontdropthesoad]

They'll never stop IRC, it's always been the best, and always will be.

All of the torrent sites will begin to fold under pressure. You can already see this on www.torrentspy.com try searching for family guy and see what slaps you in the face.

If they start doing that for everyone that contacts them, they'll be down in a month.


The only torrent sites that'll survive are the ones based overseas.
Wow you were right it is alot faster, but I have yet to find a bot that can send me a whole file without disconnecting :/

[TFS]

Wow you were right it is alot faster, but I have yet to find a bot that can send me a whole file without disconnecting :/
You're going through all this trouble when Wal-Mart's just around the corner.

I'm laughing...and jerking it too.

[Dontdropthesoad]

You're going through all this trouble when Wal-Mart's just around the corner.

I'm laughing...and jerking it too.
hahaha....
Ya walmart has star wars 3...

[Techoverload]

All of the torrent sites will begin to fold under pressure. You can already see this on www.torrentspy.com try searching for family guy and see what slaps you in the face.



You know its kind of funny though check this out (http://www.torrentspy.com/directory.asp?mode=sub&id=128) all they did was block the search term....if you just use the links from there dierectory/tvshows......guess what there is a whole catagory dedicated to family guy.....which means I have to click a whole extra 2 times to find the file I want :)

[EastrnPacific]

Apparently Bram Cohen is gonna release a search client independent of any web site. It could be a crushing blow to the MPAA who will no longer have a physical being to sue and shut down. What's more, he's gonna sell ad space, making this is first commercial endevor (sp?). Hmmmm.

I'll see if I can find a link to the full story.

EDIT: Here's the story (http://www.betanews.com/article/BitTorrent_Creator_Opens_Online_Search/1117065427)

[PotIsYourFriend]

Weed really does kill braincells... :rolleyes:
He saying it's funny because you're against this because it's illegal and telling us to get a job, but potheads are notoriously lazy and weed is illegal. It never ceases to amaze me how stupider people are getting.




I said it not because it's illegal but because it's stealing Obi........ Maybe you're the one who's stupid....... Like I said it doesn't make since......


P.S. I make more money than you...........

[Armed&Angry]

I said it not because it's illegal but because it's stealing Obi........ Maybe you're the one who's stupid....... Like I said it doesn't make since......


P.S. I make more money than you...........
Maybe you should use that money to buy an education and learn what the fuck ellipses are and how to use them.

[the FLY]

buying overpriced cds and dvds is wrong.

[TFS]

buying overpriced cds and dvds is wrong.
Only if you can't afford it. But then you shouldn't be buying anything you don't need. And you shouldn't be stealing it either.

And no, Wal-Mart doesn't have episode III. But if you're too impatient to wait 2 months for it to come out, that's your problem.

[Dontdropthesoad]

Yep, you are right it is. And it is none of your buisness what we download so you might as wel shut up.

[TFS]

Yep, you are right it is. And it is none of your buisness what we download so you might as wel shut up.
And you might as well learn to spell "well" right. I'm just stating the obvious: you're doing something illegal and then bitch when the government shuts your source down. I find that ironic. You have no patience, you can't wait 2-3 months and but a fucking disc, which is really sad. And don't anyone give me shit about sticking it to the man about over-priced CD's and DVD's. That's just bullshit. You had no problem paying those prices before you realized you could download this shit, and all the sudden it's a rip-off?

Pathetic. I have no sympathy. I hope they shut your new source down too.

[/\/eO]

You pro P2P, Bit Torrent creeps should be honest and just say, I like to steal. I don't care who it hurts or causes to get laid off or go bankrupt, I like to steal and I don't want to go to prison because of it.

That will still make you faggots but you will be intellectually honest faggots.

[Armed&Angry]

Dear, Neo
I like to steal. I don't care who it hurts or causes to get laid off or go bankrupt, I like to steal and I don't want to go to prison because of it.
Love,
A&A

Am I an intellectually honest faggot now?

[/\/eO]

Dear, Neo
I like to steal. I don't care who it hurts or causes to get laid off or go bankrupt, I like to steal and I don't want to go to prison because of it.
Love,
A&A

Am I an intellectualy honest faggot now?

Yes sir you certainly are. Now hop back on the short bus sonny.

[EastrnPacific]

TFS said-
You had no problem paying those prices before you realized you could download this shit, and all the sudden it's a rip-off?

You're logic is faulty. Most people are okay with what they can't control (except, of course, for some enterprising indeviduals). Its the same reason people were okay with walking before the invention of the wheel. It's a lot of effort, but there was no other way.

I don't condon stealing, but the record companies have been doing it to us forever now.

[TFS]

You're logic is faulty. Most people are okay with what they can't control (except, of course, for some enterprising indeviduals). Its the same reason people were okay with walking before the invention of the wheel. It's a lot of effort, but there was no other way.

I don't condon stealing, but the record companies have been doing it to us forever now.
Your logic is flawed like modern art.

First off, if you think walking is a lot of effort, that explains a lot.

Second, how can the people who produce, manufacture, and market the product be stealing from you? It's not like you ever had to buy music or movies.

How about you get out of the house and go for a walk? Or use your wheel, since that's too difficult for you.

Face it: in order for you to have paid those prices back in the day, you had to voluntarily pull the money out of your pocket and exchange it for cassettes and CD's and such. No one forced you to. You were ripping yourself off. They only price those things according to what people are willing to pay for them.

You can't say anyone's stealing money from you by making you pay an unfair price if the product is not a necessity to life.

Now you have it better than you did in the old days, when you never bitched about the prices and paid them like a fucking tool you are, but now you bitch about them all the time while downloading that shit for free, and everytime your source gets shut down you bitch about that too.

Nothing's good enough for you, you'll never be satisfied until someone comes to your house at 3pm on a daily basis and rams music and movies up your ass, free of charge. And then you'll bitch everytime you get the new guy who accidently shoves them up there sideways.

Get over it. There's more important things in life.

[Dontdropthesoad]

Dear, Neo
I like to steal. I don't care who it hurts or causes to get laid off or go bankrupt, I like to steal and I don't want to go to prison because of it.
Love,
A&A

Am I an intellectually honest faggot now?
Ditto

And to TFS,
You are an idiot. And making fun of my spelling just shows you don't have a valid argument. I hope the MPAA shuts down more sources, more power to them. However they can't shut them all down and so I could care less how many they shut down I can just go elsewhere.

[BUMBLEEKY]

I'm sorry, but I love downloading music that is underground. I will never be able to find music in my area let alone in this country, yet I can't download it. Music sharing actually does people good...gives them a name in the community. [/off-topic]

[TFS]

Ditto

And to TFS,
You are an idiot. And making fun of my spelling just shows you don't have a valid argument. I hope the MPAA shuts down more sources, more power to them. However they can't shut them all down and so I could care less how many they shut down I can just go elsewhere.
Read my posts, my valid argument is right there. The fact that people bitch about torrent sites being shut down is pathetic.

I could really give a damn about people pirating music, but i don't care either way. I just care when people do something they no is illegal and then get all pissy about being shut down.

Yeah, you're right. There will always be other sites. So why are you whining about one being shut down? It's pointless.

And just to spite you, I hope they shut them all down, trace your downloads, and arrest you specifically for it. Bitch about it then.

A&A, have fun. Just don't bitch about something you know is illegal, that's all I ask.

[EastrnPacific]

Love your response TFS!

Not only did you get a jab in at me for being fat (which I surly must be), but you insisted that I am violated daily with free music and movies. Classy.

How about you don't jump to conclusions about my personal life and start to look into why my arguement is actually quite valid. When someone walks, they do expend effort. To suggust that only out of shape poeple use cars is a major logical fallacy on your part. We use cars simply to not have to lose the energy it would take to walk, simple as that.

We are a constantly innovating people, one of the main reason why our culture continues to thrive in a hostile world. Sharing music digitally is just one more step in our evolution (no matter how infantasmally small it may be). Just embrace the future.

[Armed&Angry]

Read my posts, my valid argument is right there. The fact that people bitch about torrent sites being shut down is pathetic.

I could really give a damn about people pirating music, but i don't care either way. I just care when people do something they no is illegal and then get all pissy about being shut down.

Yeah, you're right. There will always be other sites. So why are you whining about one being shut down? It's pointless.

And just to spite you, I hope they shut them all down, trace your downloads, and arrest you specifically for it. Bitch about it then.

A&A, have fun. Just don't bitch about something you know is illegal, that's all I ask.
Of course not, it's illegal I know this. I just don't care that it's illegal.

[JerkyMyTurky]

The recording industry once upon a time was needed, because they had technology/ability to record and distribute music that wasn't possible before. The technology is so widely available right now, that we truly don't need the recording industry any more to record and/or distribute music. Recording technology has advanced a lot since the original album recordings and the internet is the cheapest and quickest medium for distribution of music. The recording industry is afraid, because p2p networks are showing just how useless they really are, so they try to sue and suppress new technologies so that there is still a need for them. Before the recording industry, artists performed live for their audience and were payed for it. That still happens today and that is how most artists generate most of their money, from live performances (concerts), they get very little from CD sales. File sharing is not hurting the artists as much as it is hurting the recording industry and that is one of the reasons I don't see it as a major problem, it is only showing that there is no use for them. Hopefully, a higher percentage of the money generated from online music stores will go to the artists and not the RIAA.

[MrDeliquent85]

It costs 69p to make a cd. It cost £14.99 to buy.

Who is ripping off who ?

I would have no problem paying money to the artist I like, but if a stupid company is going to quadruple the price so they can take their share for a crappy picture and booklet to go with my nice shiney box then they can keep it. I'll just download the actual songs I like.

If sony or any other of the big companies really feel scared by this then why dont they take the right action instead of sueing 15 year old kids for downloading a couple of albums.

Why dont they create their own p2p program and sell it at a reasonable fee with a registeration setup to customers. Upload all the music from artists they own and sell albums and songs for a low price.


I'll support the artists but I won't support fatcat bosses and music companies who are lining their own pockets.

[TFS]

Love your response TFS!

Not only did you get a jab in at me for being fat (which I surly must be), but you insisted that I am violated daily with free music and movies. Classy.

How about you don't jump to conclusions about my personal life and start to look into why my arguement is actually quite valid. When someone walks, they do expend effort. To suggust that only out of shape poeple use cars is a major logical fallacy on your part. We use cars simply to not have to lose the energy it would take to walk, simple as that.

We are a constantly innovating people, one of the main reason why our culture continues to thrive in a hostile world. Sharing music digitally is just one more step in our evolution (no matter how infantasmally small it may be). Just embrace the future.
I never called you fat or out of shape. You said walking was difficult, so difficult in fact that now that we have a wheel there is no need for it. That's the only way your comparison would be valid to a recording industry that is not necessary anymore.

You took my comments to say you were fat. I never said anything weight related. All I said is that you find it difficult and mocked that comment. That's like saying chewing is too difficult, I'm gonna eat foods in paste form from now on.

And I never said you were currently being violated with anything, although I am beginning to wonder. Pull your thumb out of your ass.

All that violation comment was was an attack at your argument that downloading was necessary because it is somehow easier than buying the CD. Not that it probably isn't, but if you can notice that difference to the extent you feel you need to make a change because of it, something's wrong. You're fucking lazy if that's the case. And if you are that concerned about saving energy, you'll never be happy until someone comes to your house everyday to cram everything up your ass for you.

Way to not be able to cut through the exxagerations there, bud.

I agree, the recording industry is unnecessary now, but the fact remains that burning is considered illegal, and therefore anyone who does it should not be suprised or pissed when their torrent site is shut down.

I personally, have no problem with while I'm out running errands, I stop off at a CD store or electronics department of whatever department store I'm in and browse around until I find something I'd like to add to my collection.

And as far as movies, I'd rather go to the theater and pay $6 to watch it on the silver screeen. To me, there's no better way to experience a huge blockbuster. I've watched movies on my computer. I've watched them on my home theater before, and neither are as good to me as the theater.

But you guys go ahead and download Star Wars and Longest Yard and whatever else before they hit theaters, makes it less crowded for me.

[PotIsYourFriend]

The recording industry once upon a time was needed, because they had technology/ability to record and distribute music that wasn't possible before. The technology is so widely available right now, that we truly don't need the recording industry any more to record and/or distribute music. Recording technology has advanced a lot since the original album recordings and the internet is the cheapest and quickest medium for distribution of music. The recording industry is afraid, because p2p networks are showing just how useless they really are, so they try to sue and suppress new technologies so that there is still a need for them. Before the recording industry, artists performed live for their audience and were payed for it. That still happens today and that is how most artists generate most of their money, from live performances (concerts), they get very little from CD sales. File sharing is not hurting the artists as much as it is hurting the recording industry and that is one of the reasons I don't see it as a major problem, it is only showing that there is no use for them. Hopefully, a higher percentage of the money generated from online music stores will go to the artists and not the RIAA.


LOL, since we don't need the record industry to distribute and make their music in a studio then artists can produce their own and still have you steal it...




It costs 69p to make a cd. It cost £14.99 to buy.

Who is ripping off who ?

I would have no problem paying money to the artist I like, but if a stupid company is going to quadruple the price so they can take their share for a crappy picture and booklet to go with my nice shiney box then they can keep it. I'll just download the actual songs I like.

If sony or any other of the big companies really feel scared by this then why dont they take the right action instead of sueing 15 year old kids for downloading a couple of albums.

Why dont they create their own p2p program and sell it at a reasonable fee with a registeration setup to customers. Upload all the music from artists they own and sell albums and songs for a low price.


I'll support the artists but I won't support fatcat bosses and music companies who are lining their own pockets.


Yes they make money off people but they also lose alot of money on up and coming astists that don't make it...

[MrDeliquent85]

Yes they make money off people but they also lose alot of money on up and coming astists that don't make it...

Free samples could be put up on their sites/p2p's.

I have lots of music that hasnt been released and some that will probably never make it onto the shelfs, mainly because that certain artist is from the other side of the pond (Im English). But if they had a setup like I mentioned, then more people like me would have the chance to support that up and coming artist and maybe he and the company would be happier.

By the way, if the artist is up and coming, they probably havent been heard of much so most people wont know their material exists. It wouldnt really effect them or their sales.

[PotIsYourFriend]

True but they do put alot of money into singers, like putting them in a studio, marketing, and etc.. The ones who make it, help make it possible for the others to have a shot at getting a deal to get their music out into the mainstream... To make money you have to spend money......

[Beemis]

Dear Thief,

Free samples are one thing but being a criminal is just wrong. Like handouts of a little pack of candy, 5 cigs or bar of soap; they want you to try it and then hopefully you'll buy some if you like it. What they don't expect is that you'll like it and then go into a store and steal some.

No matter how you try to justify theft, it's still just stealing. You can say that you enjoy being a crook, that it doesn't matter to you. So, I guess it would be okay with you if I came over to your place and stole your stereo, computer, TV and any other valuables that I need. Believe me, there are a lot of reasons that I can make up for me to NEED your stuff.

And it's humorous that you'd attack someone for smoking a little herb (which you obviously don't understand) while making excuses for stealing from honest people. I don't go for smoking or drinking but if someone wants to buy that stuff and consume it then it's entirely their business.

But when you steal something, it costs me. And that pisses me off. If everyone who wanted it just went and bought it, the prices would be more reasonable for the rest of it. Yes, Photoshop costs 600 bucks; it's a damned good program! But, it'd be a lot cheaper if the people who want it would actually pay for it. If you can't afford the new version you should go buy 5.0 at Wallymartz. Or use one of the many free- or shareware programs that are available.

By the way, what do you drive? What do you wear? What do you eat?

Didja steal that shit too?

If you're a thief, there is no defense. It is just plain Wrong.

Your Mommy would be so ashamed if she knew how bad you've been.

http://www.geocities.com/rollinmag/bandit.jpg
Just another Crook? (Cowboy Thief Illustration - (c)1961, Collier's Magazine)

If you want Free, go here:Top 7 Free Photo Editors for Windows (http://graphicssoft.about.com/cs/imageediting/tp/freephotoedw.htm)
or here: GIMP for Linux/Mac/Unix/Windows (http://www.mozillaquest.com/OpenSource04/Gimp-Photo-Edit-Tutorial-01_Story01.html)

[dead]

Dear Thief,

Free samples are one thing but being a criminal is just wrong. Like handouts of a little pack of candy, 5 cigs or bar of soap; they want you to try it and then hopefully you'll buy some if you like it. What they don't expect is that you'll like it and then go into a store and steal some.

No matter how you try to justify theft, it's still just stealing. You can say that you enjoy being a crook, that it doesn't matter to you. So, I guess it would be okay with you if I came over to your place and stole your stereo, computer, TV and any other valuables that I need. Believe me, there are a lot of reasons that I can make up for me to NEED your stuff.

And it's humorous that you'd attack someone for smoking a little herb (which you obviously don't understand) while making excuses for stealing from honest people. I don't go for smoking or drinking but if someone wants to buy that stuff and consume it then it's entirely their business.

But when you steal something, it costs me. And that pisses me off. If everyone who wanted it just went and bought it, the prices would be more reasonable for the rest of it. Yes, Photoshop costs 600 bucks; it's a damned good program! But, it'd be a lot cheaper if the people who want it would actually pay for it. If you can't afford the new version you should go buy 5.0 at Wallymartz. Or use one of the many free- or shareware programs that are available.

By the way, what do you drive? What do you wear? What do you eat?

Didja steal that shit too?

If you're a thief, there is no defense. It is just plain Wrong.

Your Mommy would be so ashamed if she knew how bad you've been.

http://www.geocities.com/rollinmag/bandit.jpg
Just another Crook? (Cowboy Thief Illustration - (c)1961, Collier's Magazine)

If you want Free, go here:Top 7 Free Photo Editors for Windows (http://graphicssoft.about.com/cs/imageediting/tp/freephotoedw.htm)
or here: GIMP for Linux/Mac/Unix/Windows (http://www.mozillaquest.com/OpenSource04/Gimp-Photo-Edit-Tutorial-01_Story01.html)
So smoking pot which is illegally where you live is no problem for you.
And coppying music/warez/gamez is wrong. :insane:
Where i live it's legal to download only the upload is illegal.

people make the laws and poeple can change the laws do you know why somemuch is still copyrighted ?

it's because companies have been lobbying a lot to get the copyrights from about 14 years to 100 years.

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/comment-bloom112202.asp
And the prices will not go down look at the price of windows almost everybody buys it but does the price goes down ?

[Kommercial]

But when you steal something, it costs me. And that pisses me off. If everyone who wanted it just went and bought it, the prices would be more reasonable for the rest of it. Yes, Photoshop costs 600 bucks; it's a damned good program! But, it'd be a lot cheaper if the people who want it would actually pay for it. If you can't afford the new version you should go buy 5.0 at Wallymartz. Or use one of the many free- or shareware programs that are available.

First off, I'm American, I don't give a shit how I effect anyone, other than myself. Photoshop would still be $600, if I stole it or not. If shit weren't so expensive in the first place, like music, movies, or programs, theft wouldn't be a damn problem. But, when I can debate spending $20 on a new album, which the artist barely recieves any of, or getting on the 'net for a minute or two, and downloading the album, with the small chance of getting caught, I'm taking that chance.

I don't download my music illegally, I'm paying through iTunes, which is the best thing to happen to music yet. But, when I come across a program, something like PS, or a game, I'm not spending $50-600 for it, that's ridiculous. I know the designers, and engineers, and whatever, that made the program spent all this time and money, which is good, but then again, they'll get it all back. There are still enough people out there with morals who buy their shit legally.

Either way, I download my music legally, but I may get a program or two illegally, because I'm not paying that price.

Another thing, I just wanted to make it clear that I'm not downloading illegally everything I own, I'm just stating from the outside view. I'm not an extreme pirate, but I can see where the pirates are coming from. Technology is just too expensive, and everyone wants a piece. Piracy is probably the leading "thing" on the 'net right now, and honestly, it'll probably stay that way for awhile.

Do you blame your huge car price on thieves? I paid $27,000 for my Xterra, but I can tell you now, I didn't pay that much because the car thieves are making car prices go up. It's because of greedy companies.

[/\/eO]

These pro stealing arguments are so much shit. You're essentially stating that your Wants are actually your Needs. That the advertisers have successfully brainwashed you into needing everything and since you don't have enough cash to buy it then they are the ones who are greedy? WTF? How about self-control? How about you going out and getting an education that allows you to make mad cash and you can afford to get that sweet shit? Is it the greedy corporations fault if people don't want to be upwardly mobile and to do that you must be pro active in your life’s destiny and be goal oriented? How about you mutherfuckers just live on a budget? How about you don't steal? How about you take responsibility for your lives and grow up and do something innovative?

Christ if you jackasses used just 10% of the creative energy you use to screw people out of money via the intarweb, and applied that energy to making a better mousetrap or the longer lasting light bulb some of you guys would be the next Bill Gates.

[Sir Budicus]

i have to agree the pro piracy arguements are kinda weak. Too be honest i dont give a fuck either way but in all honesty claiming it is alright to steal because the thing you stole (which is in no way a nesessity) was overpriced thereby giving you the right to steal it. It's like saying rape is alright if the girl's standards were too high. It's all about where it is you draw the line really. When stealing materialistic unnessisary items is deemed right because of the price of said object, Whats next to be allright to do because someone lacks the ability to obtain it? like I said I could give a fuck less what you all do, I'm just playing devil's advocate.

[PotIsYourFriend]

So smoking pot which is illegally where you live is no problem for you.
And coppying music/warez/gamez is wrong. :insane:
Where i live it's legal to download only the upload is illegal.

people make the laws and poeple can change the laws do you know why somemuch is still copyrighted ?

it's because companies have been lobbying a lot to get the copyrights from about 14 years to 100 years.

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/comment-bloom112202.asp
And the prices will not go down look at the price of windows almost everybody buys it but does the price goes down ?


You quoted the wrong person.. I think you wanted it to be directed at me... But your point is dumb.. I don't steal pot hence theres no relation to what the topic is about... Stealing will never be legal, sorry but its the truth.....

[dead]

You quoted the wrong person.. I think you wanted it to be directed at me... But your point is dumb.. I don't steal pot hence theres no relation to what the topic is about... Stealing will never be legal, sorry but its the truth.....
it's not stealing where do they lose a material good.
It's copying it happens all the time ofcourse a copyright law of 15 years seem good for me but it seems that now the big compagnies are stealing from the public .
and it was not pointed to you i was pointing to beemis who also pointed to pot in his post.

[JerkyMyTurky]

LOL, since we don't need the record industry to distribute and make their music in a studio then artists can produce their own and still have you steal it...

The recording industry doesn't make the music, the artists make the music. Most artists don't care about their music being traded on p2p networks, because they are not losing a great deal of money from it (15% of CD sales) and it helps market their music (just like radio does). They make most of their money from touring (live concerts) around the world and they would much rather have their music heard more (whether by radio or by p2p), so that more people will have an interest to go to their concerts. You say the artist can produce their own music and still have people steal it, but I don't think the artists view it like that, only the recording industry does. If artists produced and recorded their own music, they would be supporting p2p networks to further market their music. My point is, only the RIAA is worried about p2p, because it makes them useless.

(quotes from when Napster was not a pay service)

"I just want my music to be out, and that's always been the main priority. It was never really about getting paid. It was just getting people to hear my music and say, 'Hey, I like your song.' So if Napster wants to put my song out so people can download it or whatever, let 'em do it."
-- Billy Joe Armstrong (Green Day), Reuters, 2/12/2001

"Napster: It is the future, in my opinion. That's the way music is going to be communicated around the world. The most important thing now is to embrace it, and that was the spirit by which we did this co-promotion."
-- Dave Matthews (Dave Matthews Band), referring to his band's recent Featured Music promotion with Napster, Billboard.com, 2/9/2001

"Most people I know who use Napster listen to stuff they've never heard before. And then they get psyched and go out and buy the damn records. It's more like a sampler."
- Ian MacKaye, recording artist, Fugazi and co-owner of Dischord Records, Salon.com, 1/8/2001

"We believe that the Internet and Napster should not be ignored by the music industry as tools to promote awareness for bands and market music."
-- Fred Durst (Limp Bizkit)

"There are a lot of bigger problems in the world than whether Napster succeeds or fails...I don't think there is a malice coming out of Napster. We allowed people to tape our concerts from the beginning, and the record company questioned us about allowing that. But my thinking was that it only makes people want to buy more and increases the devotion of people who are going to listen to us."
-- Dave Matthews (Dave Matthews Band), Rolling Stone, 7/21/2000

"[Napster] makes artists ask why they are not in control of what they are doing. Artists of any worth or strength will rise up and take control of the situation."
-- Dave Stewart of the Eurythmic

"The amount of time companies spend stressing about getting a record on radio, you would think that the idea of some big, global listening post would make perfect sense. And while enough people enjoy the social interaction of going into a record shop and buying something to keep and cherish, I don't see why we can't all live in one big happy music-sharing world."
-- Damian Harris (owner of SKINT) (Fatboy Slim's label), NME, 9/8/2000

"The cool thing about Napster is that it...encourages enthusiasm for music in a way that the music industry has long forgotten to do."
-- Thom Yorke (Radiohead), 10/9/2000

"Napster could be a great way for people to hear your music who wouldn't have the chance to hear it on the radio."
-- Madonna, Rolling Stone, 9/28/2000

"Most people I know who listen to a lot of MP3s will download a lot of different songs. And if they like the song, they'll go out and buy the album. The record company doesn't want me to say this, but out of the millions of MP3 files that are out there, if someone chooses to download one of my songs or an album of mine, I'm very flattered."
-- Moby, Macaddict.com

"What record companies don't really understand is that Napster is just one illustration of the growing frustration over how much the record companies control what music people get 2 hear < over how the air waves, record labels and record stores, which r now all part of this 'system' that recording companies have pretty much succeeded in establishing, r becoming increasingly dominated by musical "products" 2 the detriment of real music. Y should the record company have such control over how he, the music lover, wants 2 xperience the music?... >From the point of view of the real music lover, what's currently going on can only b viewed as an xciting new development in the history of music. And, 4tunately 4 him, there does not seem 2 b anything the old record companies can do about preventing this evolution from happening."
-- Prince, NPGonlineLTD.com

"We should think of (Napster) as a new kind of radio--a promotional tool that can help artists who don't have the opportunity to get their music played on mainstream radio or on MTV,"
-- Chuck D, New York Times, 4/30/2000

"The Edge is very pro-Napster, actually," Bono says. "He thinks that as long as people are using their computers for music, and not playing mindless games, that's good. My feeling," he adds, "is that it's cool for people to share our music -- as long as no one is making money from the process. We tell people who come to our concerts that they can tape the shows if they want. I think it's cool that people are so passionate about our music -- especially about this new album, quite honestly."
-- Bono on The Edge (U2), Billboard.com, 9/29/2000

"I think it's a good idea because it's people trading music. It has nothing to do with industry or finance, it's just people that want music and there's nothing wrong with that. It's the same as someone turning on the f****** radio, it's the same as someone putting a cassette in a cassette deck when the BBC plays a special radio session. I don't think it's a crime, it's been going on for years. It's the same as people making tapes for each other. The industry is more threatened by it because it's the worldwide web and it's a broader scope of trading, but I don't think it's such a f******* horrible thing. The first thing we should do is get all the f****** millionaires to shut their mouths, stop bitching about the 25 cents a time they're losing."
-- Dave Grohl (Foo Fighters), dotmusic.com, 9/15/2000

"It is a good way to promote your music, but copyright and things of that sort are something that will have to be worked out and they will be worked out. I remember when they didn't want you to have a VCR, but they worked it out and I think for the best. Smart people always get together and work it out."
-- B.B. King, Yahoo Entertainment News, 9/13/2000

"We're not afraid of the Internet. We think it's a very cool way to reach our fans. If a band sells 12 million albums, what are we supposed to say? Oh, maybe we could have sold 13 million if we had just been Internet Nazis. Frankly, at a certain point, you have to say. Hey, let the people have the music."
-- Dexter Holland (Offspring), Inside.com, 9/15/2000

"We have just finished a tour, we played in Barcelona, the next day the entire performance was up on Napster and three weeks later when we got to play in Israel the audience knew the words to all the new songs and it was wonderful. Digital music is just one of many things that contribute to an artist getting their message across and of course it is going to change record companies are going to have to embrace it and change with it and find different ways of getting revenue, maybe using Napster as a business model for their own on-line thing."
-- Colin Greenwood (Radiohead), NME, 9/28/2000

"I can't believe Napster might be shut down. Music is for everybody. When people get excited about it, whether from hearing it on the radio or borrowing a record from a friend, or accessing it through Napster, they buy records and come out to shows."
-- Ben Folds (Ben Folds Five), Entertainment Weekly, 8/11/2000

[JerkyMyTurky]

Alex Kapranos- Lead Singer of Glasgow band Franz Ferdinand

"To be honest I'm all for song swapping online. Downloading music from the internet is something I do myself and something that I'd be keen to encourage. "From my experience it isn't necessarily the musicians themselves that are against it, but those companies involved in the music industry. "The way the music industry is trying to regulate online sites at the minute is very heavy handed - fining kids for downloading songs is just crazy. File-sharing is something that has really helped us as a band in getting established. When Franz Ferdinand played a gig in New York for the first time, a lot of people there already knew our songs and were singing along. For us it has been global word of mouth that has helped our progress, not hindered it."

Chuck D- Chuck D, famous rapper and founding member of Public Enemy

"Technology giveth and it taketh away, and the industry knows this. The horseshoe makers probably got upset at the train manufacturers because (the new industry) took away their transport dominance, just as the train manufacturers probably got mad at the airline industry."

"As an artist representing an 80-year period of black musicianship, I never felt that my copyrights were protected anyway. I've been spending most of my career ducking lawyers, accountants and business executives who have basically been more blasphemous than file sharers and P2P. I trust the consumer more than I trust the people who have been at the helm of these companies."

Beastie Boys- Mike D of the Beastie Boys

"Napster's an underdeveloped technology and flawed in many ways," said Michael Diamond, more commonly known as Mike D with the cutting-edge band, which was among the first white acts to strike a hip-hop attitude. "To me, the positive opportunity to exist here is this is the wake-up call for the music industry, and we need to figure out how to make that work for users and creators alike. Maybe I'm just a dreamer on that."

Radiohead- An interview with Thom Yorke of Radiohead

Q. Speaking of stealing, that's what the music industry calls file-sharing. How has access to your music on the Internet through these unauthorized channels helped or hindered Radiohead?


A. I hate to say it, but it sort of has helped, because people got to hear bits of our albums beforehand. And as we discussed, access to radio can be quite limited. So it was a nice way of spreading the word around. It may affect how many people buy CDs, but I don't know for sure. Personally I want to vomit when I hear the record company heads using file-sharing as an excuse for their slipping revenues, when to me the reason that revenue is slipping in the music business is because most of the stuff they're trying to sell you is (expletive)! And people don't want to buy it.

Most of these quotes are from main stream artists/bands who have already got their foot in the door and they are still defending p2p. There are a lot more independant artists/bands who, without p2p, would never get a minute of their music on the radio. P2P is their only way to get heard.

The effects of file sharing will only benefit the artists (giving them more control of their music) and consumers of music (giving them the ability to purchase music without having to buy over priced CDs with only 2 or 3 good tracks and the rest with filler) and only hurt the music industry.

[Liquid_NRG]

[off topic]Who remembers downloading about 42 zip files for one game on "warez" sites? All those got shut down and then we had p2p.[/off topic]

I agree, I download and I know it's wrong but meh, I don't download EVERY SINGLE THING I SEE. Like, I downloaded Star Wars EPIII, but, I've also gone to the theatre and have seen it 4 times. :shuffle:

I've gone out to buy albums I've downloaded because I want the booklets n such. I think, the MPAA doesn't want to acknowledge the fact that in it's own way, downloading of stuff spreads it's awareness and get's more people on it.

:D

[Beemis]

Rant, rant, blah-dee-blah.
Your logic is impecable, Mr. Spock.

I refuse to argue with a crazy person.

Most of these quotes are from main stream artists/bands who have already got their foot in the door and they are still defending p2p. There are a lot more independant artists/bands who, without p2p, would never get a minute of their music on the radio. P2P is their only way to get heard.The effects of file sharing will only benefit the artists (giving them more control of their music) and consumers of music (giving them the ability to purchase music without having to buy over priced CDs with only 2 or 3 good tracks and the rest with filler) and only hurt the music industry.

JMT: Excellent research there, I wasn't aware of that aspect of the argument.

And that reminded me of when we first got cassette tape player/recorders and "stole" everything we could right off the radio. And then we copied cuts off other people's albums and tapes. Seems it's the same as P2P download now that I think about it that way. Thanks for making a logical point.

But, software is another side of the argument. Maybe I see it differently because I am in the industry and theft affects me directly. But before getting into the vendor side, I was a graphic artist who made his living by creating art for my customers. Some of them didn't pay. They used the product anyway. Lawyers were too expensive. My wife and kids' diets suffered for a while there. Yes, it's personal.

Don't steal stuff or I'll send someone over to your house to take your XTerra's (OMG! You can affor 27g's for that piece o' shit but not $15 for a CD or DVD or piece of S/W? WTF?!!) that you NEED so badly.

[JarOfFlies]

Are there any torrents that are faster the Limerwire Pro? I had bitronado, and it was taking days to download files which would take an hour on Limewire.

P.S - It's plain to see I know nowt about "torrents"

[Dontdropthesoad]

I see no problem with downloading if you own or plan to own the product.

Thereis no way that I am not going to buy Episode III I am just impatient so I downloaded it until I get the retail version.

[MoDilly]

Weed really does kill braincells... :rolleyes:
He saying it's funny because you're against this because it's illegal and telling us to get a job, but potheads are notoriously lazy and weed is illegal. It never ceases to amaze me how stupider people are getting.
There is so much irony and hypocrisy in that statement I think my head is going to explode.

[camilo]

I've read all your arguments pro and against file sharing.

We all perfectly know that file sharing it's illegal, it doesnt matter if you agree or disagree with that, it will be illegal anyways.

There are two options:
1. You can dowload music for free without too much effort, but illegaly
2. You can BUY the CD, legally

However, you dont want to do something wrong, therefore you will justify your actions with a lot of different arguments and you'll repeat those arguments until you take them as true. After that, you will download music for free without consider yourself as a thief.

Now, before you write some answer think about this:
You can disagree with the laws, but it will never be an excuse to break them.
Thanks

[MoDilly]

You can disagree with the laws, but it will never be an excuse to break them.
Thanks
What if the natural order of things, disagrees with the laws?

[whocares]

What if the natural order of things, disagrees with the laws?
Can you please elaborate your statement? I don't know what the fuck are you meaning.

The law is the law, is not about "the natural order of things", whatever the fuck does it mean. In this case it defends copyrights.

However, I think the main illegal download and sharing is happening because of the inflated prices of the CD's, DVD's and other stuff like that. If they weren't that expensive this wouldn't be as a big of a problem. Also, you gotta remember that there bands that offer they mp3 for downloading, so if you download it, it's NOT illegal.

The bad thing is, the music industry is ripping people off with those CD's prices, however, they are not breaking the law, they are on their right. Afterall, it's not illegal to sell things at high costs. So, as long they don't lower the prices and higher the music's quality (man, most of the actuals bands suck) this will continue.

Anyway, this is still a minor crime. Afterall, you're not hurting anyone nor taking off material of anyother.

Still is breaking the law, though. Maybe in the future they will come with a deal with file sharing and it will be not illegal anymore, still sounds very impossible at this time.

[MoDilly]

Can you please elaborate your statement? I don't know what the fuck are you meaning.

The law is the law, is not about "the natural order of things", whatever the fuck does it mean. In this case it defends copyrights.

However, I think the main illegal download and sharing is happening because of the inflated prices of the CD's, DVD's and other stuff like that. If they weren't that expensive this wouldn't be as a big of a problem. Also, you gotta remember that there bands that offer they mp3 for downloading, so if you download it, it's NOT illegal.

The bad thing is, the music industry is ripping people off with those CD's prices, however, they are not breaking the law, they are on their right. Afterall, it's not illegal to sell things at high costs. So, as long they don't lower the prices and higher the music's quality (man, most of the actuals bands suck) this will continue.

Anyway, this is still a minor crime. Afterall, you're not hurting anyone nor taking off material of anyother.

Still is breaking the law, though. Maybe in the future they will come with a deal with file sharing and it will be not illegal anymore, still sounds very impossible at this time.
I agree mostly about the record stuff. What I was trying to say is just because somethings a law, doesn't make it right. It also doesn't make it wrong to break that law. Not specifically this law though.

[whocares]

I agree mostly about the record stuff. What I was trying to say is just because somethings a law, doesn't make it right. It also doesn't make it wrong to break that law. Not specifically this law though.
Well, that's mostly based on each criteria. I mean, yes, I also find this law somewhat wrong and all this stuff utterly ridicolous. Still, it's breaking the law, sadly.

And I don't think downloading music is so bad because on that way, you can get to know a band's style and quality. I mean, if you directly buy their CD at $17, and then you don't like it. You'll be regreting that. And also, you can't have a devolution.

However, there are people that abuse this and use it to download music like crazy and don't but CD's, and worse, some of them even make profit of this. I think they should be the ones that should be hunted down. However, there's still no perfect way to know which ones make a "correct" use of this and who don't.

[MoDilly]

Well, that's mostly based on each criteria. I mean, yes, I also find this law somewhat wrong and all this stuff utterly ridicolous. Still, it's breaking the law, sadly.

And I don't think downloading music is so bad because on that way, you can get to know a band's style and quality. I mean, if you directly buy their CD at $17, and then you don't like it. You'll be regreting that. And also, you can't have a devolution.

However, there are people that abuse this and use it to download music like crazy and don't but CD's, and worse, some of them even make profit of this. I think they should be the ones that should be hunted down. However, there's still no perfect way to know which ones make a "correct" use of this and who don't.
Agreed completely. The government is already doing what they can to crack down on the people making profits off of it. I DL music all the time, but if I like the album, I go buy it. I don't have much money, and I can't be listening to music for a first time by buying everyones CD's. You have to sift through the crappy music somehow right?

[jn_powell]

You have to sift through the crappy music somehow right?
It's called the radio. People, even broke ones, got by just fine for decades without having to illegally download music to see if they liked it.

[whocares]

It's called the radio. People, even broke ones, got by just fine for decades without having to illegally download music to see if they liked it.
Yeah, but on nowadays music, they only put on the radio the "best" of the bands. I have bought CD's from bands I liked their singles and then got completely disappointed. I.E. Linkin Park (that's why I hate them now) and Evanescence.

On other hand, as well. I have bought CD's from other bands and got amazed. I.E. AFI, Red Hot Chili Peppers.

Anyway, that's just my opinion. I don't feel like a thief for this. If I download a song and I don't like it. I just delete it. Without sharing it.

And if I like some songs of a specific band, the most probably thing to happen is me buying their CD.

EDIT: And yes, I know just because "I don't feel like a thief", doesn't mean that I'm not breaking the law. Anyway, I'm not so on downloading music now.

[JerkyMyTurky]

It's called the radio. People, even broke ones, got by just fine for decades without having to illegally download music to see if they liked it.

Just because you get by, doesn't mean you shouldn't move on to something that can offer a better service. Just like when people got by just listening to live music, but eventually started to buy recorded music. Maybe they should have just canned recording technology and stuck with the old method. Radio is greatly controlled by the music industry, they pay to have the songs they want to be played, not what the people want to hear. I rarely listen to the radio, but when I do listen, its constantly the same songs over and over again. They push what they want on the consumer, instead of the consumer pushing the industry to give them what they want. Independent artists NEVER get on the radio and they are the ones in the most need of air time. They are also the only ones offering original/creative styles. Pop music is dishing out cookie cutter bands and artists for the past 10 years. That is the primary reason people are getting fed up with the industry, a primary reason why music sales are going down.

As I said before, downloading copyrighted material maybe wrong, but the end result will end up giving better options for the consumers and even the artists. Independent artists are being better marketed on the internet, than they ever could on the radio. File sharing is a great tool for them. The music industry has too much control, it they use their power only benefit themselves, not the consumers and not the artists. We are better without them.

[jn_powell]

Just because you get by, doesn't mean you shouldn't move on to something that can offer a better service. Just like when people got by just listening to live music, but eventually started to buy recorded music. Maybe they should have just canned recording technology and stuck with the old method.
I was referring to illegally downloading copyrighted materials, not downloading in general. If you want to purchase your music and download it then fine, but downloading music illegally is stealing. I am not trying to get on a high horse here, because I have thousands of MP3's I downloaded, but regardless I know it was wrong.
Radio is greatly controlled by the music industry, they pay to have the songs they want to be played, not what the people want to hear. I rarely listen to the radio, but when I do listen, its constantly the same songs over and over again. They push what they want on the consumer, instead of the consumer pushing the industry to give them what they want. Independent artists NEVER get on the radio and they are the ones in the most need of air time. They are also the only ones offering original/creative styles. Pop music is dishing out cookie cutter bands and artists for the past 10 years. That is the primary reason people are getting fed up with the industry, a primary reason why music sales are going down.
No argument here, radio sucks, but what else is there?
As I said before, downloading copyrighted material maybe wrong, but the end result will end up giving better options for the consumers and even the artists.
I don't see how. How will illegally downloading some MP3's create better options for anyone?
Independent artists are being better marketed on the internet, than they ever could on the radio. File sharing is a great tool for them. The music industry has too much control, it they use their power only benefit themselves, not the consumers and not the artists. We are better without them.
I agree that the internet is great for up and coming groups. You are right that file sharing is great if it is done legally. My friend has a band, a quite popular band actually that is touring with the Warped Tour right now, and they put their recorded songs on their website to download which I think is great. What would make it not great is some jackass putting their songs out for free download without them knowing about it and saying it is ok. I think more bands should do things like this. At the very least they should stream their albums on their websites so that people can hear what the album sounds like before they decide whether or not to buy it.

[JerkyMyTurky]

I was referring to illegally downloading copyrighted materials, not downloading in general. If you want to purchase your music and download it then fine, but downloading music illegally is stealing. I am not trying to get on a high horse here, because I have thousands of MP3's I downloaded, but regardless I know it was wrong.

In most cases, radio doesn't offer what the internet has to offer, even when considering legal downloads and streams. You have more of an option on the net, than you do on radio. We shouldn't limit our options when they are available to us. My main point is, we are satisfied with the status quo, when we should be demanding for better service. Radio wouldn't be so bad, if the music industry didn't have so much control over what was played on it. For example, they have online "radio" stations that are commercial free and can be modified so that you listen to music of your liking.

I don't see how. How will illegally downloading some MP3's create better options for anyone?

Illegal downloads is what garnered attention and all the problems of the industry got highlighted, when they tried to lay full blame on their low sales on file sharing, when in reality, it is one factor among many. Once everyone became aware of these problems, the industry was forced to address some of them. One example is forcing people to buy a full CD, when the consumer is primary interested in only 2 or 3 songs. Now, they are offering online music services that let the consumer buy the songs they want individually, instead of having to buy the "filler" that comes with a cd. Online music stores may have never came about if p2p technology and the illegal downloading of music was never in the limelight. It's part of changing the business model, which they don't want to do, because they fear there will be less need for them. They fear their loss of control. Less control from the music execs means more control by the artists, because there is less reliance on the music industry. The music industry controls when and if an artist's album can be released. Fiona Apple is currently the perfect case. She is under contract with Sony, she made an album about a year and half ago, but Sonly chooses not to release the album, because they believe it will not succeed at the moment. I guess what she and her fans think isn't important, because the fans are requesting the album to be released, even though the album was leaked on the radio and the internet. Her fans actually want to support the artist, but Sony doesn't think they would make enough money. That is having too much power, when they are supposed to be providing a service to the artists, but they believe the artists are providing a service to them. It should be the other way around and that is why I don't feel bad if the industry and its execs fall.

[MoDilly]

It's called the radio. People, even broke ones, got by just fine for decades without having to illegally download music to see if they liked it.
Most of the bands I like, aren't on the radio. Basically I would be forced to listen to what the music industry wants me to hear, that would suck a lot of ass, don't you think? And the reason they got by for decades without it, is because just over a decade ago, a download didn't even exist.

EDIT: Sorry this was answered like 4 times already. :shuffle:

EDIT: EDIT: One quick question, Im not to up to date on the laws of this, but I thought it was only illegal if you're uploading? Is that true, or is it illegal to dl also.

[JerkyMyTurky]

One quick question, Im not to up to date on the laws of this, but I thought it was only illegal if you're uploading? Is that true, or is it illegal to dl also.

The first part is true, it is not illegal to download music, but the term "illegal downloading" is often used, when sharing is what makes the whole process illegal.

[MoDilly]

The first part is true, it is not illegal to download music, but the term "illegal downloading" is often used, when sharing is what makes the whole process illegal.
Ok. So I am totally abiding by the law, as long as I don't share. Thats what I thought. I have an old friend who I just talked to the other day, doesn't know shit about computers. He's getting sued because apparently he downloaded 10,000+ songs from Ares, and left Ares on 24/7. Basically he was uploading a propostorous amount of music. I think theyre asking for 5,000 as a settlement :lol: :lol: :lol: Sucks to be him.

[PotIsYourFriend]

If someone stole your car and called to tell you that they wanted a car just like it but the dealer was aking to much so they stole your car would you care?

Come one people it's STEALING no matter how much you say it's not.... You only steal it because you can hide behind a computer... If you're going to steal be a man about it... Go out and rob a music store atleast you'll have decent sound quality....

[whocares]

If someone stole your car and called to tell you that they wanted a car just like it but the dealer was aking to much so they stole your car would you care?

Come one people it's STEALING no matter how much you say it's not.... You only steal it because you can hide behind a computer... If you're going to steal be a man about it... Go out and rob a music store atleast you'll have decent sound quality....
This got to be one of the senseless comments in here.

First, it's not the same. That analogy with the car doesn't belong in here. We're copying a file into our computer. So, the real owner doesn't lose anything.

Second, yes the music companies are asking too much for a Music CD, even from the crappiest artists.

Third, the sound quality is the down-side of this. A 128KBPs mp3 file is just a decent quality.

[PotIsYourFriend]

This got to be one of the senseless comments in here.

First, it's not the same. That analogy with the car doesn't belong in here. We're copying a file into our computer. So, the real owner doesn't lose anything.

Second, yes the music companies are asking too much for a Music CD, even from the crappiest artists.

Third, the sound quality is the down-side of this. A 128KBPs mp3 file is just a decent quality.



Your copying it not buying it, so yes the owner is LOSING.. 10 bucks is to much? Wow.......


Maybe sooner or later you might make someone believe it's not stealing but not decent people.......

[whocares]

Your copying it not buying it, so yes the owner is LOSING.. 10 bucks is to much? Wow.......


Maybe sooner or later you might make someone believe it's not stealing but not decent people.......
Well, I never said it wasn't stealing. I just said that the real owner of the song doesn't lose a thing. As for the Music company, yes, it's stealing from them, even when you don't plan to buy the CD.

And what the fuck? The price isn't 10 dollars for most CD's. It always is around 16-20 dollars.

The 10 dollars CD's are mostly albums that didn't sell, or albums that the music store just want to get away.

As I said earlier, I know this is wrong, but not as wrong as these people wants you to see it. Besides, mp3 downloading can also help bands to get known around the world.

Many bands offer some of their music for free download so they get promoted along the people, and heck they get profit from it. However, these people just like to see the bad side on this.

[PotIsYourFriend]

Well, I never said it wasn't stealing. I just said that the real owner of the song doesn't lose a thing. As for the Music company, yes, it's stealing from them, even when you don't plan to buy the CD.

And what the fuck? The price isn't 10 dollars for most CD's. It always is around 16-20 dollars.

The 10 dollars CD's are mostly albums that didn't sell, or albums that the music store just want to get away.

As I said earlier, I know this is wrong, but not as wrong as these people wants you to see it. Besides, mp3 downloading can also help bands to get known around the world.

Many bands offer some of their music for free download so they get promoted along the people, and heck they get profit from it. However, these people just like to see the bad side on this.




Alot of artists get paid a certain amount per unit sold, so please do some research.....



http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7192806&type=product&id=1432277

[jn_powell]

Well, I never said it wasn't stealing. I just said that the real owner of the song doesn't lose a thing. As for the Music company, yes, it's stealing from them, even when you don't plan to buy the CD.

And what the fuck? The price isn't 10 dollars for most CD's. It always is around 16-20 dollars.

The 10 dollars CD's are mostly albums that didn't sell, or albums that the music store just want to get away.

As I said earlier, I know this is wrong, but not as wrong as these people wants you to see it. Besides, mp3 downloading can also help bands to get known around the world.

Many bands offer some of their music for free download so they get promoted along the people, and heck they get profit from it. However, these people just like to see the bad side on this.
As I said before, if the band does that, then feel free to download all you want, otherwise it is illegal, it is wrong, and it is stealing. Claiming it is not as bad because you are only stealing from the rich record company makes no sense. Is it better to steal from Wal-Mart than your local mom/pop convenience store? Any way you look at it you are stealing.

[whocares]

Alot of artists get paid a certain amount per unit sold, so please do some research.....

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7192806&type=product&id=1432277
Yes, they get paid a certain amount per unit sold. And I said most of the CD's aren't 10 dollars. That depends mainly on the store. Sorry, I didn't make that clear.

http://www.shopemi.com/album_page.asp?upc_id=094631128028

http://gear.overstock.com/cgi-bin/d2.cgi?page=proframe&prod_id=1464835

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/sim-explorer/explore-items/-/B0006L16N8/0/101/1/none/purchase/ref%3Dpd%5Fsxp%5Fr0/102-9133860-2039322

However, you betcha that at that price ($10 dollars), many people won't doubt buying it.

As I said before, if the band does that, then feel free to download all you want, otherwise it is illegal, it is wrong, and it is stealing. Claiming it is not as bad because you are only stealing from the rich record company makes no sense. Is it better to steal from Wal-Mart than your local mom/pop convenience store? Any way you look at it you are stealing.
I didn't say it wasn't that bad because you're stealing from a rich record company, I was meaning it wasn't that bad because of that way you can make sure that won't be disappointed with the purchase of a certain album.

As you may have guessed the radio mainly offers the "best" of the artist. What about the rest of the CD? How can you make sure that is not just crap, or that is not the same thing over and over?

Yes, you can just buy the single, but still, it's overpriced. In my opinion.

Again, yes, it is stealing, it is breaking the law. However, I somehow disagree with the actions that are being taken from the MPAA.

The ones that should be sent to jail are the one that are making illegal bussiness with those files. I totally agree with that.

To conclude: what I'm trying to say is that the music records should try to find a better solution with this, maybe some deal with those torrents sites or something.

[MoDilly]

To conclude: what I'm trying to say is that the music records should try to find a better solution with this, maybe some deal with those torrents sites or something.
I agree completely. The internet isn't gonna go away. The industry needs to find a way to work with it, instead of fighting it.

[JarOfFlies]

Seriously, Torrents suck. Even with Broadband, it's crap. It's like you have the slowest ever dial-up connection. That's with everything.

[MoDilly]

Seriously, Torrents suck. Even with Broadband, it's crap. It's like you have the slowest ever dial-up connection. That's with everything.
Thats why you pick and choose your torrents. Most of my torrents go at a speed of at least 150 kb/s after the first 10 minutes of connecting to seeders and other downloaders.

[jn_powell]

As you may have guessed the radio mainly offers the "best" of the artist. What about the rest of the CD? How can you make sure that is not just crap, or that is not the same thing over and over?

You can't. Just like you cannot go to Barnes and Noble and take a book home and read it to make sure you want to buy it. Just like you cannot go to Wal-Mart and take home a loaf of bread to make sure you like it before you decide to purchase it. Just like you cannot go take a box of condoms at 7-11 and test them out to make sure you like them before you decide to buy them. It is a $15 CD, not a $20,000 car that you have the option to test drive before purchasing.

[JarOfFlies]

I'll add my opinion on this;

I download what I want, because it's free. It's as simple as that. I don't have to pay anything for what I download. Whether it's films, tv shows, music. People are generous enough to share their files so that's awesome.

[jn_powell]

I'll add my opinion on this;

I download what I want, because it's free. It's as simple as that. I don't have to pay anything for what I download. Whether it's films, tv shows, music. People are generous enough to share their files so that's awesome.
You mean people are "generous" enough to share files they stole (i.e. did NOT pay for) illegally. How very nice of them. :rolleyes:

[JarOfFlies]

They "copied" them.....

Oh yeah!

[jn_powell]

They "copied" them.....

Oh yeah!
What is the difference?

[JarOfFlies]

Hmmmmm.....

I'll be damned if I know.

[whocares]

You can't. Just like you cannot go to Barnes and Noble and take a book home and read it to make sure you want to buy it. Just like you cannot go to Wal-Mart and take home a loaf of bread to make sure you like it before you decide to purchase it. Just like you cannot go take a box of condoms at 7-11 and test them out to make sure you like them before you decide to buy them. It is a $15 CD, not a $20,000 car that you have the option to test drive before purchasing.
All of those examples involve taking something away physically. While you download you don't take anything away, you just copy it. Yes, again, it's stealing and it's illegal. However, I don't see it as that bad.

It's just my opinion on this. I sometimes download music from time to time, but never an entire album, if I like the songs of some artist, I'll surely buy the CD, because I'd like the have the original booklet, the real CD quality, etc.

If I don't like it, I just delete the songs.

Yes, I know it's wrong. I'm stealing in the process. Still, I don't see it as that bad.

[JarOfFlies]

It's not a serious crime.

You're breaking the law, but compared to other crimes, it's nothing. You're copying files. You're hardly killing someone.

[jn_powell]

It's not a serious crime.

You're breaking the law, but compared to other crimes, it's nothing. You're copying files. You're hardly killing someone.
Agreed. You guys have to understand that I am playing devil's advocate here. I download all the time, even though I know it is wrong. I agree with every statement I have made here, but even though I know it is wrong, I still do it.

[camilo]

That's even worse, dont you think?

[jn_powell]

That's even worse, dont you think?
How am I any worse than anyone else? At least I acknowledge that what I am doing is wrong as aopposed to knowing it is wrong but trying to make excuses.

[MoDilly]

Agreed. You guys have to understand that I am playing devil's advocate here. I download all the time, even though I know it is wrong. I agree with every statement I have made here, but even though I know it is wrong, I still do it.
To be honest, in my case, I still don't see it as stealing. If I download an album, and I like it, I go buy it. If I don't like it, I don't buy the album. No one has gained or lost anything they could have possibly had or not had. If a band writes one song for the radio, and writes a shitty album that they don't care about (which a loooooooot of bands do), I consider that to be stealing peoples money.

I mean seriously, say I go and find a work by Picasso on the internet. I save that file, so that I can view it in full detail in order to write a paper about it. If downloading songs is considered stealing, then that would be stealing also, right? And you can find almost any piece of artwork ever created on the internet, gauranteed.

I'm one of those people who, if I back into a parked car in a parking lot, and nobody sees me, I will still leave my phone number on the car so that they can contact me, so the argument of sitting behind a computer has no ground in my case. I act the same when no one is around and my morals stand firm, always. I have never stolen a thing in my life, except for a toy truck that I took from my day care when I was in pre-school and at that time, I just didn't know any better.

Yah in most peoples cases they are stealing. But that is not a universal fact, some people have morals, and some people do what is right. I just don't see it as stealing in my case, and I don't know how it's possible to to even make it seem like it's stealing.

[jn_powell]

To be honest, in my case, I still don't see it as stealing. If I download an album, and I like it, I go buy it. If I don't like it, I don't buy the album. No one has gained or lost anything they could have possibly had or not had. If a band writes one song for the radio, and writes a shitty album that they don't care about (which a loooooooot of bands do), I consider that to be stealing peoples money.
How is that stealing people's money? There is no guarantee on the box. I am the same say though, if I like something I go buy it, though not because of my superior morals, just because I prefer the quality. Unfortunately millions of people don't do that, which is a problem.
I mean seriously, say I go and find a work by Picasso on the internet. I save that file, so that I can view it in full detail in order to write a paper about it. If downloading songs is considered stealing, then that would be stealing also, right? And you can find almost any piece of artwork ever created on the internet, gauranteed.
Artists make money by selling a piece one time or through grants, therefore this is not stealing if you are taking nothing from the artist. Also, Picasso is dead.
I'm one of those people who, if I back into a parked car in a parking lot, and nobody sees me, I will still leave my phone number on the car so that they can contact me, so the argument of sitting behind a computer has no ground in my case. I act the same when no one is around and my morals stand firm, always.
I would hope anyone would do the same, but evidenced by the back of my car, that is obviously not the case.
I have never stolen a thing in my life, except for a toy truck that I took from my day care when I was in pre-school and at that time, I just didn't know any better.
That was you? Son of a bitch.
Yah in most peoples cases they are stealing. But that is not a universal fact, some people have morals, and some people do what is right. I just don't see it as stealing in my case, and I don't know how it's possible to to even make it seem like it's stealing.
taking something you did not pay for is stealing, whether you end up liking it or not.

[camilo]

How am I any worse than anyone else? At least I acknowledge that what I am doing is wrong as aopposed to knowing it is wrong but trying to make excuses.


That's exactly why is wrong.

You know you're doing something illegal, something wrong, nevertheless you dont want to change, you dont want to improve.
Your thoughts about download music are worthless because you dont support them. Your actions contradict your thoughts.

Basically, you dont respect your own thoughts.

[jn_powell]

That's exactly why is wrong.

You know you're doing something illegal, something wrong, nevertheless you dont want to change, you dont want to improve.
Your thoughts about download music are worthless because you dont support them. Your actions contradict your thoughts.

Basically, you dont respect your own thoughts.
I never claimed to be morally superior or perfect.

[JerkyMyTurky]

I mean seriously, say I go and find a work by Picasso on the internet. I save that file, so that I can view it in full detail in order to write a paper about it. If downloading songs is considered stealing, then that would be stealing also, right? And you can find almost any piece of artwork ever created on the internet, gauranteed.


That is a good analogy, I was thinking about it earlier. When concerning artwork, there is nothing like the original. You can make millions of copies that are nearly identical to the original, but the original will always be valued more. The same goes with a music artist, you can record their voices, but nothing will be able to copy the experience of a live performance. The music industry is a business of copying and selling music. I can do the same thing as the music industry does for free, why don't they? There is no longer a need for the music industry in their current business model, either they change or they should be boycotted. Support your favorite artists by going to their concerts, not by buying their cds.

[MoDilly]

Artists make money by selling a piece one time or through grants, therefore this is not stealing if you are taking nothing from the artist. Also, Picasso is dead.
I dunno why I used Picasso, but yah, they also have prints made, that they make royalties off of.

That was you? Son of a bitch.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

taking something you did not pay for is stealing, whether you end up liking it or not.
But see where do we draw the line? Because stealing something implies a physical action, you physically take something from someone and the object which you took is tangible. This isn't true for downloading.

If I could pay a dollar a song, I would totally do it. But the fact is, that the only way I can download most of the music I listen to is by dling from a free site or p2p program. Itunes doesnt have shit, Rapsody has a decent amount of songs, but they still don't have half of what I listen to. There needs to be a solution, I think every band should offer their music on their website for download for like a dollar a piece or something like that. Do you know how much money they would make from doing that? They don't even have to give you a CD. It's just the file, which is free to them, the only thing theyre spending is bandwidth costs, which they were already paying in the first place for the site.

However that would take away the aspect of letting me hear it first, but theres still places like cdnow and amazon that let you hear the first 30 seconds to a minute of all songs which kinda sucks, but it gives you a good idea of how good or bad the album is gonna be. Theres plenty of solutions to this problem, it's the industries fault for not taking care of it in a business like manner. Instead they go around tossing frivalous lawsuits at fucking college students like candy. Bastards.

[camilo]

I never claimed to be morally superior or perfect.

I know.
My point is, your morals about downloading music seems to be lower than other people.

Theres plenty of solutions to this problem, it's the industries fault for not taking care of it in a business like manner. Instead they go around tossing frivalous lawsuits at fucking college students like candy. Bastards.

No one forces you to download music.
It'll be always your fault.

You dont want to risk your $15 then dont buy the CD.
No one has died from no listen lindsay lohan

[jn_powell]

This isn't true for downloading.
Come on man.
If I could pay a dollar a song, I would totally do it. But the fact is, that the only way I can download most of the music I listen to is by dling from a free site or p2p program. Itunes doesnt have shit, Rapsody has a decent amount of songs, but they still don't have half of what I listen to. There needs to be a solution, I think every band should offer their music on their website for download for like a dollar a piece or something like that. Do you know how much money they would make from doing that? They don't even have to give you a CD. It's just the file, which is free to them, the only thing theyre spending is bandwidth costs, which they were already paying in the first place for the site.
I love the idea, or at the very least they could let you stream their tunes to see if you like them before you go buy the album.
However that would take away the aspect of letting me hear it first, but theres still places like cdnow and amazon that let you hear the first 30 seconds to a minute of all songs which kinda sucks, but it gives you a good idea of how good or bad the album is gonna be. Theres plenty of solutions to this problem, it's the industries fault for not taking care of it in a business like manner. Instead they go around tossing frivalous lawsuits at fucking college students like candy. Bastards.
I also like how many stores have the CD's there for you to listen to in the store before you decide wheter or not to purchase them. The only problem is that they can only do this for the newest CD's because of space restrictions. You can't have thousands of CD's out for people to listen to.
I know.
My point is, your morals about downloading music seems to be lower than other people.
Whatever you say.

[whocares]

I know.
My point is, your morals about downloading music seems to be lower than other people.

No one forces you to download music.
It'll be always your fault.

You dont want to risk your $15 then dont buy the CD.
No one has died from no listen lindsay lohan
Actually, many people think like that. We know this is wrong, but hey, we aren't making profit out of this, we just download the music just for personal use, or to decide wheter to buy a certain album or not.

If we like a certain artist's music, we decide to support them by buying their album, and why not, maybe an older album of theirs.

The people who has the lowest standards are the ones who download music and never buy a CD. Not to mention the people that decide to make bussiness out of this.

[MoDilly]

No one forces you to download music.
It'll be always your fault.

You dont want to risk your $15 then dont buy the CD.
No one has died from no listen lindsay lohan
If you had a passion for music, and truly appreciated and loved the art, you wouldn't say such things.

The internet exists, I'm not going to ignore it, what I'm doing is completely LEGAL, so I'm not breaking any laws. And as far as stealing from the bands goes, if I don't like the album then they never deserved my money in the first place. If I do like the album, then they will get the money they earned and deserve. Music is the biggest thing in my life, if I missed out on all the great music out there, simply because I'm a broke college student, that would be absolutely horrible for me. I am doing absolutely nothing wrong, any way you look at it. I'm gonna preview their shit so I can decide if I want to buy it or not, theres no possible way you can legitamitely call me wrong for doing that.

[camilo]

If you had a passion for music, and truly appreciated and loved the art, you wouldn't say such things.

The internet exists, I'm not going to ignore it, what I'm doing is completely LEGAL, so I'm not breaking any laws. And as far as stealing from the bands goes, if I don't like the album then they never deserved my money in the first place. If I do like the album, then they will get the money they earned and deserve. I am doing absolutely nothing wrong, any way you look at it.


Copying and sharing copyrighted music is illegal. We have been discusing that for 30 pages !!!!!!!!!!!
Why do you think is LEGAL? Did I miss something?

[MoDilly]

Did I miss something?
You obviously missed this...
EDIT: EDIT: One quick question, Im not to up to date on the laws of this, but I thought it was only illegal if you're uploading? Is that true, or is it illegal to dl also.
The first part is true, it is not illegal to download music, but the term "illegal downloading" is often used, when sharing is what makes the whole process illegal.

[whocares]

You obviously missed this...
From what I know, downloading from P2P is also illegal, since you're not paying for it. Unless the band allows you to download it.

I would like to see a document where is stated that just downloading is not illegal.

http://mp3.about.com/od/isitlegal/a/riaalawsuits.htm


Not all Internet music downloading is legal

I hate to say it, but the best red flag that you're illegally downloading music is that your music is free and downloaded from a P2P file sharing network. If it is copyrighted (excluding music designated as free using a Creative Commons license or EFF's Open Audio License), especially from a major label, someone will be upset about missing royalties. While there are places where you can find free promotional downloads and free rights music from popular (and not so popular) artists, this is the exception, and most files shared on P2P networks are not this kind of file.

Don't get me wrong, I still think that this is not as bad.

[camilo]

You obviously missed this... :rolleyes:


is jerkymyturkey your source? it must be true :rolleyes:

If I just download sound recordings, is it still a copyright violation?

Yes. It is a violation if you upload or download full-length sound recordings without permission of the copyright owners. You should assume other people's works are copyrighted and can't be copied unless you know otherwise.
http://www.riaa.com/issues/music/downup_faq.asp

[MoDilly]

is jerkymyturkey your source? it must be true :rolleyes:


http://www.riaa.com/issues/music/downup_faq.asp
Thanks for the link, i have many unanswered questions about the laws on this.

[JarOfFlies]

From what I know, downloading from P2P is also illegal, since you're not paying for it. Unless the band allows you to download it.

I would like to see a document where is stated that just downloading is not illegal.

http://mp3.about.com/od/isitlegal/a/riaalawsuits.htm



Don't get me wrong, I still think that this is not as bad.

Ah ha!

What if you're using Limewire Pro? You have to pay for that.

Unless you download it for free OFF Limewire.. :p

[MoDilly]

Ah ha!

What if you're using Limewire Pro? You have to pay for that.

Unless you download it for free OFF Limewire.. :p
Is it monthly, yearly, or is it just a one time payment?

[JarOfFlies]

Is it monthly, yearly, or is it just a one time payment?

Well, free for me..

[MoDilly]

Well, free for me..
Uhhhh ok, I realize this. How about for everyone else who pays for it?

[JerkyMyTurky]

Downloading music is not illegal. Links...

http://www.dansdata.com/filesharing.htm


This legislation doesn't apply very elegantly to P2P file sharing, but so far as it does, it says that downloading music is legal, but making music available for download isn't, because that counts as "broadcasting".


Downloading music is LEGAL, its the "sharing" the "uploading" of music that is illegal. I could have 1,000,000 songs on my PC as long as I don't "share" them. If you didn't know that or are confused, check out the famous "Betamax" decision which can be found at the URL below. This is the law that rules the current music controversy of p2p like kazaa. Only uploaders or sharers are prosecuted:

Sony Corp. v. Universal City Studios, Inc.
- The “Betamax” decision
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?
court=us&vol=464&invol=417


http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/10/arts/music/10INTE.html?ex=1252555200&en=1754341400ebc367&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland


DOWNLOADING music from the Internet is not illegal. Plenty of music available online is not just free but also easily available, legal and — most important — worth hearing.

That fact may come as a surprise after highly publicized lawsuits by the Recording Industry Association of America, representing major labels, against fans using peer-to-peer programs like Grokster and EDonkey to collect music on the Web. But the fine print of those lawsuits makes clear that fans are being sued not for downloading but for unauthorized distribution: leaving music in a shared folder for other peer-to-peer users to take.

These links were posted in an earlier thread in CE a few weeks back. Credit to droog for finding the nytimes link.

[BradBrigade]

Music is the biggest thing in my life, if I missed out on all the great music out there, simply because I'm a broke college student, that would be absolutely horrible for me.

I feel the same way about guitars. That's why I broke into the guitar shop down the street and stole the $3000 Les Paul they had on display. And I fucking TOLD the judge that I stole it cause I felt horrible that I didn't own it, and the jackass STILL put me in jail!

According to him, you don't have the right not to feel horrible. Who knew?

[whocares]

I feel the same way about guitars. That's why I broke into the guitar shop down the street and stole the $3000 Les Paul they had on display. And I fucking TOLD the judge that I stole it cause I felt horrible that I didn't own it, and the jackass STILL put me in jail!

According to him, you don't have the right not to feel horrible. Who knew?
You didn't get the point do you?

That example you posted involves stealing something physically. Is not exactly the same with file downloading.

[camilo]

Downloading music is not illegal. Links...



Those links and references says that you can download some songs. You're generalizing (sp?).
Not all the music can be downloaded legally.

UNITED STATES CODE ANNOTATED
TITLE 17. COPYRIGHTS
CHAPTER 1--SUBJECT MATTER AND SCOPE OF COPYRIGHT
Current through P.L. 105-153, approved 12-17-97

s 102. Subject matter of copyright: In general

(a) Copyright protection subsists, in accordance with this title, in original works of authorship fixed in any tangible medium of expression, now known or later developed, from which they can be perceived, reproduced, or otherwise communicated, either directly or with the aid of a machine or device. Works of authorship include the following categories:
(1) literary works;
(2) musical works, including any accompanying words;(3) dramatic works, including any accompanying music;
(4) pantomimes and choreographic works;
(5) pictorial, graphic, and sculptural works;
(6) motion pictures and other audiovisual works;
(7) sound recordings; and
(8) architectural works.



U.S. Copyright Law {Title 17 U.S.C. Section 101 et seq., Title 18 U.S.C. Section 2319} Federal law protects copyright owners from the unauthorized reproduction, adaptation, performance, display or distribution of copyright protected works.

Penalties for copyright infringement differ in civil and criminal cases. Civil remedies are generally available for any act of infringement without regard to the intention or knowledge of the defendant, or harm to the copyright owner. Criminal penalties are available for intentional acts undertaken for purposes of "commercial advantage" or "private financial gain." "Private financial gain" includes the possibility of financial loss to the copyright holder as well as traditional "gain" by the defendant.

Where the infringing activity is for commercial advantage or private financial gain, sound recording infringements can be punishable by up to five years in prison and $250,000 in fines. Repeat offenders can be imprisoned for up to 10 years. Violators can also be held civilly liable for actual damages, lost profits, or statutory damages up to $150,000 per work.

[BradBrigade]

You didn't get the point do you?

That example you posted involves stealing something physically. Is not exactly the same with file downloading.

Someone loses revenue. Stealing is stealing.

Don't give me any bullshit like "I wouldn't have bought it anyway" or "I just wanted to sample it then buy it". Maybe they didn't want you to sample it. That's their right. THEY CREATED IT!

It's not yours. Don't take.

[camilo]

Someone loses revenue. Stealing is stealing.

Don't give me any bullshit like "I wouldn't have bought it anyway" or "I just wanted to sample it then buy it". Maybe they didn't want you to sample it. That's their right. THEY CREATED IT!

It's not yours. Don't take.Totally agree




Im starting to realize that some members just bypass all the evidence, so here is the final evidence:



Who says that sharing music through peer-to-peer networks is illegal?

Federal law and a string of court decisions. Federal copyright statutes (specifically, Sections 501 and 506 of Title 17 of the United States Code) and the “No Electronic Theft” (NET) Act provide penalties for the unauthorized reproduction, distribution, rental or digital transmission of copyrighted sound recordings. Moreover, an unbroken series of court decisions—most recently, in Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Studios, Inc., et al. v. Grokster, Ltd., et al., and in RIAA v. Verizon Internet Services Inc.—has affirmed that “sharing” copyrighted music files over peer-to-peer networks without the copyright holder’s permission constitutes “direct infringement.”

EDIT: http://www.riaa.com/news/newsletter/062503_b.asp

[Dominator]

Actually, they do make money off of TV shows. You mentioned Family Guy, all Family Guy episodes are available on DVD.

There are still some good torrent sites, Torrent Reactor for example. Here are some Family Guy (http://www.torrentreactor.net/sections.php?id=138) torrents for you. Enjoy. :)
How do u get those torrent files to work? I tried opening the files with several media players and none work.

[MoDilly]

It's not yours. Don't take.
I dont take, I borrow. If I like it then I buy it and the get the money. If I don't like it then it goes wherever my recycle bin decides to send it when I empty it. I can guarantee you, that nobody is losing money from people like me, nor are they making money that they don't deserve.

I'm not gonna walk into an art gallery, have myself blindfolded and walk around randomly till I find a piece that I want. Im going to look at all the pieces and buy the ones I want, depending on cost and budget. So who are you or anybody to say I can't hear what I'm buying first, as long as its readily available and legal to do?

[Danimal87]

Music CDs are way too damn expensive for me to care about who the money is going to. Or who it WOULD be going to, since I've only gotten like 2 music CDs in my entire life. Rest are downloaded. :)

[SnuchiBootchies]

How do u get those torrent files to work? I tried opening the files with several media players and none work.

youve gotta be kidding me....dont tell me you tried to open a .torrent file in a media player!

[BradBrigade]

I dont take, I borrow. If I like it then I buy it and the get the money. If I don't like it then it goes wherever my recycle bin decides to send it when I empty it. I can guarantee you, that nobody is losing money from people like me, nor are they making money that they don't deserve.

I'm not gonna walk into an art gallery, have myself blindfolded and walk around randomly till I find a piece that I want. Im going to look at all the pieces and buy the ones I want, depending on cost and budget. So who are you or anybody to say I can't hear what I'm buying first, as long as its readily available and legal to do?

It seems the point still escapes you. IF someone were to open an art gallery with all their own art and state that you MUST pick a piece of art blindfolded, that is their right to do so. If you decide to break in at night and look at everything then you are breaking the law. It's their art. They decide how they want to give it to you.

It's not even like that though. It's like a guy opening an art gallery and a bunch of people break in at ni